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Tools & Supplies: Airbrushes
Talk about airbrushes.
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Artograph booths...
inqzitr
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Posted: Friday, January 18, 2008 - 07:31 PM GMT+7
Particularly, anyone use the 1530- the big brother to the 1520, which I've read that some ppl have had problems with. Interestingly, my paasche hobby booth gives me problems with regard to blowback, which is why I'm thinking of updating.

Thoughts?
inqzitr
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Posted: Sunday, January 20, 2008 - 02:46 AM GMT+7
Awwww, c'mon. Somebody has to have some experience here....

Well, I actually found out how to search this site, and did some homework. For those that use the 1530, they seem to like it. Probably b/c it clears 3-4x more air than my paasche, at least 2x as much as the 1520, is open, now has a 'window' so you can hook up a lamp outside the booth for light inside, etc. I like the fact that its big, 30" wide, and yet can sit on top of a small cabinet, as the fan(s) are in the base. Also, it's 'open' allowing one to look down on the project, as opposed in on the project. big problem with my current booth: no light, have to look in, still gets blowback. Good and sturdy.

Downsides = the filter, but I think there' s a work around for this- I might make another 'floor' made of mesh/plastic, something that will let the air through, but still provide a good base. That way I don't have to purchase a roll of 'prefilter.' But then again, ~40$ for a huge roll of the base paper isn't too bad either. The booth walls also sometimes have gaps that have concerned people, but you can seal it easily with some caulking.

Yea, I've seen the pace booths, but I don't know... I just don't like them.

Any other info/experiences?
inqzitr
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Posted: Saturday, January 26, 2008 - 02:28 PM GMT+7
O.k., since I'm carrying on a solo conversation, I thought I'd add a bit more. I decided to order an artograph 1530 and am waiting for it. I'll provide a review and comparison with other booths I've used/seen when I get it. One thing I am interested to see: how having suction from the floor of the booth will affect spraying.
matt
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Posted: Saturday, January 26, 2008 - 03:28 PM GMT+7
Alot of guys here have homemade ones.. soem have some bought ones..... I built a downdraft style..... a pair of 6" brushless muffin fans draw the fumes out....... mine is about 20x24 of area...........
inqzitr
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Posted: Tuesday, January 29, 2008 - 12:29 PM GMT+7
Yea, my first (and best) beast was an a/c plenum, turned on it's side, with an old a/c unit blower for a fan. The thing could suck pencils off your desk! It was great.

But, the reason for this is that I'm having to share workspace with the wife/fam, so it needs to be a bit more 'presentable' than what I've used int he past. That way I can leave it out, and not upset too many ppl.

The other thing is that if you price how much it costs to build a booth, it often isn't any cheaper than buying one that's premade, unless you get the items at a major discount/free.

I'm all for building one though. I could build one that would likely be better than many booths out there. It just depends on how 'presentable' it needs to be.
JPTRR
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Posted: Wednesday, January 30, 2008 - 12:57 AM GMT+7
Hi,

Are these the booths sold by MicroMark? If so, I have one and have been very disappointed with it. It has blowback, the corners leak air, the rear does, too. I intend to replace it as soon as I save the $$$$.

Somewhere in the forums I asked this same question. Not many answers, either. I actually intend to do a review of the booth.

Regards,

Fred
inqzitr
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Posted: Wednesday, January 30, 2008 - 01:02 PM GMT+7

Quoted Text

Hi,

Are these the booths sold by MicroMark? If so, I have one and have been very disappointed with it. It has blowback, the corners leak air, the rear does, too. I intend to replace it as soon as I save the $$$$.

Somewhere in the forums I asked this same question. Not many answers, either. I actually intend to do a review of the booth.

Regards,

Fred



The one sold by MM and testors appear to be the 1520, which is a bit different in a couple respects. First, it moves about 1/2 as much air (being the 1530 has 2x the fans) and because of this, you will get blowback.

This is the problem I have with my paasche as well. I'm fine if I don't spray 'hard' or anything that is thick/heavy. If I do, I get blowback, and this sucks. I believe this has to do with the power of the booth motor and perhaps to some extent the design. The sloped back on my paasche means that any overspray hits the rear of the booth and comes back on an angle. If the motor were powerful enough, it should suck this out of the booth. But it doesn't always do so.

Re: leaks- the paasche is the same way. Small leaks. Easy to resolve if you seal it somehow.

In theory, the 1530 should get around some of this. First of all, it moves ~400 cfm IIRC, using two fans. More airflow should mean it is more likely to move/catch overspray. I'm not sure how the filters ont he bottom will do, but I find that I'm spraying down more than towards the filters (in the back) of my both anyway.

I think there will still be the problem of potential leakage, but again, airflow may help with this.

I've read a couple reviews on the 1530, both of which were positive. Here they are:

http://www.cybermodeler.com/hobby/tools/artograph/tool_artograph.shtml
http://www.ipmsusa2.org/Reviews/Archive/Products/Artograph/artograph_spraybooth.htm

A couple other reasons for getting this booth:
- I'd like to do some ship models, and my booth just isn't big enough.
- Problems with lighting: it just gets so DARK behind/in my booth and cramped. When using a light on the side, gets even more cramped and alters how the model will look in ambient light. I like how the guy in the first article put a light behind the translucent hood of the booth.

The main reason for this is not working with acrylics, but with enamels and other organic solvent based media, and to have something nice looking so I can have it in the 'living area' of the fam.

Is there a formal review method/form for doing such reviews? I've found that there are relatively few reviews that do much good for a person trying to be 'informed' because they don't compare products, or compare them to a standard (not that anyone has set any up...)

Hope this helps....
inqzitr
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Posted: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 - 10:06 AM GMT+7
O.k., I rec'd my booth today, but PB down for maintenance, so I'll have to update later. I'll do a more extensive evaluation than "oh, yea, its cool. It works." I'll try to compare/contrast with my other booth, give my impressions overall. There are a couple things I REALLY like about this booth, so I'll cover those too.
Murdo
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Posted: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 - 10:20 AM GMT+7
Hello mate,

I'm just about to attempt my first scratchbuilt "spray booth". I've never seen a spray booth before so this should be interesting.

Basically it's going to be a wooden box with some fans attached... And some kind of filter stuff..
inqzitr
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Posted: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 - 04:28 PM GMT+7
O.k., here's the first part of my review of the 1530 artograph booth.

The box came today and was shipped well. It was wrapped in plastic, with a cardboard frame to support it within the box. Here's what it looked like after he took it out and placed it on the microwave stand that is going to be my new airbrush booth stand:



and after the plastic was removed:



There are two large fans in the base of the unit, which are covered by a three stage filter. Here's what they look like:

The prefilter --


The other filters --


Interestingly, this is no more sophisticated than my paasche booth's filters, apart from the prefilter. As you can see, the prefilter is rather transparent. It looks like a single sheet of poly fiber, similar to what air filters look like in heating units.

there are two outlets where the fans vent, which can be vented outside. I has seen people combine these into a single outlet, which is what I will likely do.



There's also a switch for turning the unit on and off, which I like. My other booth does not have this:



The rest of the booth was assembled from sheet metal along with a plastic top, which was tinted blue. I suppose if you were using incandescent lights giving of a yellow/orange hue, this would tend to make the light more like regular daylight.



I left the top somewhat loose so I could remove the plastic and have real light come in the top if I desired.

Here's what it looks like assembled and sitting its pedestal:



a couple of interesting things that I tried out --

-- originally I was thinking of getting something like Mr. Superbooth- for those of you that have not seen this, this is what it looks like:



I was pleased to find that I could tip the smooth easily on its side, and it would stay quite solidly.



this also demonstrates the suction of this unit -- I was able to throw a piece of paper against it, and it stuck. I also did some tissue, smoke, etc.- all drew nicely into the vented surface.

Why would you want to do this, you ask? Well, what I'm spraying acrylics on figures, doing very light weathering, etc., I'm not too worried about overspray. I would also rather work directly at the model while I'm sitting. This is why I was interested in that other spray booth. So, I'll have to play with this. The fact that you can remove that could easily makes this even more functional for me.

Anyway, this is the end of the preview. I'll report more on performance a little bit later.
inqzitr
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Posted: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 - 09:53 PM GMT+7
o.k., gave the booth my first test run tonight. Painting a bunch of figures (for wargaming...) Here's my observations.

First of all, I had to get used to the painting surface. I was basically painting on top of a huge soft filter! There wasn't any stiffness, really, to it, which is something I'm not used to (usng another booth made of sheet metal.

I mount my figs on boards, so these sat nicely in the booth. I'm sure that if I had some 12"x12" boards, masonite or whatever, they would provide an ample enough base to paint on. I also use both an AB stand from tamiya and a rotating carousel (kitchen supplies...) that I regularly paint on, and thes would work as well. I'm thinking that I'll I could drill holes in some masonite, which would allow for a bit more airflow through the surface, and use that as a base.

the nice thing is that if you hold you 'subjects' which I like to do, you can spray right now in the filter. The booth site up high on the table, so it works well if you spray standing up.

I didn't have the booth vented outside; only using it to catch some overspray from acrylics/inks/etc. worked well for that..

update: 2-9:

Well, I've used it a couple times, and I love it. I have it sitting on a cart, and wheel it over to whereever I'm working at. Plastic top is pretty cool for lighting purposes. Also nice to stand and spray directly down into a filter. No overspray that I've noticed.

Solved the problem not having a spraying surface by getting some $2 attic vent mesh overs, that are sturdy, yet let overspray easily pass through them.
inqzitr
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Posted: Monday, February 18, 2008 - 06:10 AM GMT+7
Well, I've used the booth multiple times now, and I have to say that I love it. I works really well, and I particularly like that I can see what I'm doing (i.e. its open, light gets in, etc.)

Here's the screens I'm using for stands when I paint...



I got these at Home depot for $2.29 a piece. They work great.

ALSO:

here is some discussion on finescale re: booths. May be helpful.


http://cs.finescale.com/forums/833659/ShowPost.aspx

inqzitr
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Posted: Monday, February 18, 2008 - 09:14 AM GMT+7
Project for today: building a vent for my booth.

I got some masonite (1/8 stuff, I would normally use 1/4, but oh well...). Cut two holes in it, put in some cheap vents, then attached 2 flexible hoses to them (one from my other booth...)



I then bought a kit that has 'quick hookups'- these plastic things- to hook into the booth.



and a close up...



They hook up rather well, and don't really have that much air seepage around them.





And this is the whole set up...



And my new brush! YA!



The reason for this: quick set up and take down. I can store the vent part in the garage/closet, and bring it out when I need to vent outside.
countdemoney
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Posted: Monday, February 18, 2008 - 02:20 PM GMT+7
I have the Artograph 1530. It's a great booth. I got mine at MicroMark when they had their annual sale. If you can afford it go for it
WingTzun
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Posted: Monday, February 18, 2008 - 04:34 PM GMT+7
Thanks for the post. I bought one from Dixieart a year ago but my assaulted my hobby room with junk and I have yet to set mine up. I liked what I saw when I got it and Dixieart had the best price I found. I'm bookmarking this for when I do get to set mine up. I had the same idea for venting it.
inqzitr
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Posted: Monday, February 18, 2008 - 06:28 PM GMT+7
Yep, great booth! Thanks for the replies!

Tonights project entailed spraying a bunch of laquer/solvent based sprays... I was interested to see how well it would handle doing some volume spraying...

Here's the booth post spraying...


Using my trusty paasche H...



Which I use when spraying these as I have to do less cleaning.

Of note, I got to use my new little MAC valve that I picked up from taiwan... sold by a bunch of people, though.



You can find these on ebay, which is where I got mine. Theory was I could control air on this brush, as well as my CMB and SBP brushes. It works REALLY WELL.


results:
Pretty good. Still had some 'smells' left in the room, but very FAINT- which I would consider a success overall. that was after about 1-2 hours of spraying in the room too.

I sprayed a variety of decanted sprays, including armory black and krylon black. Wow. Krylon stinks, for sure. The booth handled MOST of it, though when I started stacking stuff inside the booth and spraying (i.e spraying with a bunch of stuff I already had sprayed) and the filter was being blocked, it didn't clear as quickly as I'd like.

Additionally, my venting system may not be as airtight as I'd like, esp. around the window, so some of the odors could be coming from there. The area around the fan also can have some gaps, where the sheet metal isn't flush, so I'll have to seal those as well.

When I cleaned off the table top/filter, it started venting well again. This is something that even the manufacturer warns about.

I also got some blowback if I didn't spray inside the booth.

I got a flourescent light and clamped it to the top for light. Worked like a charm.

Overall, I'm pleased, though I'm going to have my wife give a 'smell test' to make sure I'm not just delusional from the fumes, if really present.



inqzitr
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Posted: Monday, March 03, 2008 - 09:48 PM GMT+7
Well, final words:

I think this booth functions pretty well overall. Here's what I give it:

It is a solid unit, but not heavy. Great fans. Good solid materials- metals for the most part- that have been used. There are some minor gaps in the sheet metal which fumes could pass through. It looks good sitting on the top of the cart. It functions well, and has great air flow.

The filters on the bottom take a little time to get used to. You will need to use some sort of 'base' to set your models on.

Worth $350? That's a matter of opinion, but I'm satisfied with my purchase.
buzzconroy
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Posted: Tuesday, March 18, 2008 - 04:11 PM GMT+7
Hi
I am new here, just wanted to tell you, that plastic top is clear plastic , that blue is the a plastic wrap film protector to prevent scratches when shipping, it will peel off, use a knife at a corner to start peeling it back..I am buying one also, my friend has one its great, you can seal gaps with silicone calking.

Randolph
inqzitr
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Posted: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 - 12:46 AM GMT+7
Yea, I wish i could just say "hey, you're right! It's just blue plastic!!! Silly me!"

But i can't because I've already taken the blue wrap off of it. It is also full thickness blue plastic, which you can see from the side. I didn't think it was that strange, though; you can get blue even down at home depot.

So for whatever reason, I have a blue plastic top to my booth. The upside of the blue- when i have an warm light above it, it make the light more 'white', which works out well. Like being under an OTT light or something.

Seriously, thanks for pointing that out. There was a blue film on it, and after I stripped it off I said "What the....it's... blue?!?!?" But after trying it, I didn't mind.

:)


BTW- here's some of the fun I've been having. As you can see, I like tabletop gaming, and play/collect/build some 40K and other stuff. Here's a couple recent pieces that I did:





and





An update re: the liners-

- I've found that if you are doing heavy spraying, you'll dirty up the prefilter pretty quickly- but I'm probably spraying what most people would spray after quite a while.

- The filters tend to make for an unsteady surface, so if I inadvertently put stuff on the surface, there is a likelihood that spills can happen, dirtying things even faster!

buzzconroy
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Posted: Thursday, April 17, 2008 - 12:39 AM GMT+7
Wow you do beautiful work, I am into vintage figure kits and a bit of everything,I am just getting into pearl powders, I love this hobby.Thanks for posting your work, here is a sample of what I do, this is an Aurora 1958 Gold Knight of Nice I did with an iwata airbrush. I enjoy figures kits, getting into war stuff abit, cause I like weathering.
Randolph





this is my current project

inqzitr
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Posted: Friday, April 18, 2008 - 01:27 PM GMT+7
[quote]Wow you do beautiful work, I am into vintage figure kits and a bit of everything,I am just getting into pearl powders, I love this hobby.Thanks for posting your work, here is a sample of what I do, this is an Aurora 1958 Gold Knight of Nice I did with an iwata airbrush. I enjoy figures kits, getting into war stuff abit, cause I like weathering.
Randolph

Nice work! What did you use for your golds?
buzzconroy
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Posted: Friday, April 18, 2008 - 03:29 PM GMT+7
[quote]
Quoted Text

Wow you do beautiful work, I am into vintage figure kits and a bit of everything,I am just getting into pearl powders, I love this hobby.Thanks for posting your work, here is a sample of what I do, this is an Aurora 1958 Gold Knight of Nice I did with an iwata airbrush. I enjoy figures kits, getting into war stuff abit, cause I like weathering.
Randolph

Nice work! What did you use for your golds?


Thank you, I base coated the knight and armour in gloss black, then applied deluted Liquitex Antique gold in very thin transparent layers for a tarnish look.This model is 1.8 scale a large kit.
Randolph
inqzitr
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Posted: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 - 05:57 PM GMT+7
[quote]
Quoted Text


Quoted Text

Wow you do beautiful work, I am into vintage figure kits and a bit of everything,I am just getting into pearl powders, I love this hobby.Thanks for posting your work, here is a sample of what I do, this is an Aurora 1958 Gold Knight of Nice I did with an iwata airbrush. I enjoy figures kits, getting into war stuff abit, cause I like weathering.
Randolph

Nice work! What did you use for your golds?


Thank you, I base coated the knight and armour in gloss black, then applied deluted Liquitex Antique gold in very thin transparent layers for a tarnish look.This model is 1.8 scale a large kit.
Randolph



do you mean the liquitex antique gold soft body acrylic? How many layers did you put on?

thanks for sharing!
buzzconroy
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Posted: Wednesday, May 07, 2008 - 11:45 PM GMT+7
Yes,soft body, I applied about 2 transparent coats mixed with tamiya thinner, letting some black show through to give a tarnish look.

Buzz
inqzitr
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Posted: Sunday, October 04, 2009 - 03:24 PM GMT+7
Wow! it's been a long time. Well, after using this booth for about a year, it is still very useful. I've used it extensively over the past year without any problems.

A couple of pros: it is light, so it's easy to move around. The top area has a sheet of plexiglass that can be swapped out or even removed if needed.

My only complaint is that I wish my workspace was a little bit bigger, but most of the time I have no problems. Of course, lighting is always an issue with a booth.

One consideration is that you don't need to spray inside the booth. The top is removable, and you could place it vertically in front of you to catch overspray and suck out fumes. Ive done this with good effect on my workbench, sort of like the gunze super booth, and it works well.

I hope people have found this useful. I'll try to put up more reviews of tools I commonly use, particularly airbrushs.