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Armor/AFV
For discussions on tanks, artillery, jeeps, etc.
M42 Duster, Vietnam theme decal help
juge75
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Jasz-Nagkyun-Szolnok, Hungary
Joined: May 02, 2009
KitMaker: 735 posts
Armorama: 733 posts
Posted: Monday, January 03, 2011 - 06:25 AM GMT
Produces one of Vietnam War on M-42 Duster decal?
I do not want to use the Tamiya Decals boring.
The main problem is that I want to build a credible vehicle, which is spectacular.
But I found a photo of this topic, you do not see the serial number painted on its side, or do not see anything out of it.
Frenchy
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Rhone, France
Joined: December 02, 2002
KitMaker: 8,240 posts
Armorama: 8,045 posts
Posted: Monday, January 03, 2011 - 07:05 AM GMT
What about "George of the Jungle" ? :






You can also present your Duster with the hull ammo boxes open, to hide the side markings :




Finally here's another way to solve the markings problem



HTH

Frenchy
thathaway3
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Michigan, United States
Joined: September 10, 2004
KitMaker: 1,354 posts
Armorama: 537 posts
Posted: Monday, January 03, 2011 - 09:58 AM GMT
Awesome photos. Imagine having to explain to your CO why your track is turret deep in water!!

Any idea what unit this is? To be perfectly accurate, the bumper numbers should match, although I doubt most people would know the difference.

It's too bad your first photo doesn't extend just a bit more to the bottom so you'd be able to identify the unit and vehicle.
TonyDz
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United States
Joined: December 13, 2009
KitMaker: 420 posts
Armorama: 419 posts
Posted: Monday, January 03, 2011 - 12:08 PM GMT
Sorry but M42s were not too "spectacular".





The Tamiya decals would look better had they done them right. "HAVE GUNS WILL TRAVEL" should be yellow. Also it seems, if not the whole Battalion, most the C Btry 5/2 ADA M42s were marked with it.






Quoted Text

It's too bad your first photo doesn't extend just a bit more to the bottom so you'd be able to identify the unit and vehicle.



It can only be from one of 3 Bn.s deployed, 1/44 ADA, 4/60 ADA, or 5/2 ADA.
joegrafton
#059
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United Kingdom
Joined: October 04, 2009
KitMaker: 1,171 posts
Armorama: 1,109 posts
Posted: Monday, January 03, 2011 - 12:18 PM GMT
Hi Juhasz,
Mabye you could try Mec Models.com
He has some great decals for all different kinds of US vehicles in Vietnam.
You should be able to find what you are looking for over there.
He is a great guy, too!
Good luck with your project.
Joe.
thathaway3
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Michigan, United States
Joined: September 10, 2004
KitMaker: 1,354 posts
Armorama: 537 posts
Posted: Monday, January 03, 2011 - 02:01 PM GMT

Quoted Text









It can only be from one of 3 Bn.s deployed, 1/44 ADA, 4/60 ADA, or 5/2 ADA.



It looks like your first shot is XXIV (XXIV Corps) with 1AW44 below and offset and the track is C222.

According to my Order of Battle Vietnam, the "AW" stands for Automatic Weapons. It calls these units "Artillery" not differentiating them from "Field" Artillery, but the distinctive unit insignia they show is definitely from the ADA regimental system, not FA.

The third shot is IIFFV (II Field Force Vietnam) and is 5AW2, and the track is maybe C 231?

According to the OOB book, 4/60 was in IFFV.

windysean
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Wisconsin, United States
Joined: September 11, 2009
KitMaker: 1,626 posts
Armorama: 684 posts
Posted: Monday, January 03, 2011 - 02:24 PM GMT
By coincidence, the latest www.squadron.com sales catalog arrived in the mail today, and the Squadron-Signal book "M42 Duster Walk Around" is on sale for only $4 USD. I don't know what shipping would cost you from Texas or how long you could wait though.
-Sean
Frenchy
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Rhone, France
Joined: December 02, 2002
KitMaker: 8,240 posts
Armorama: 8,045 posts
Posted: Monday, January 03, 2011 - 06:30 PM GMT

Quoted Text

It's too bad your first photo doesn't extend just a bit more to the bottom so you'd be able to identify the unit and vehicle.



Maybe mud could come to the rescue and "hide" the missing markings



Frenchy
juge75
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Jasz-Nagkyun-Szolnok, Hungary
Joined: May 02, 2009
KitMaker: 735 posts
Armorama: 733 posts
Posted: Monday, January 03, 2011 - 09:59 PM GMT
Thank you, I have them displayed, but they did not give any serial number or signal corps.
The other question would be: Merdec staining was used after the war, only this time the National Guard used Dusters.
These were not painted white (or black, gray) star, serial number and signal corps?
TonyDz
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United States
Joined: December 13, 2009
KitMaker: 420 posts
Armorama: 419 posts
Posted: Tuesday, January 04, 2011 - 02:47 AM GMT

Quoted Text

According to my Order of Battle Vietnam, the "AW" stands for Automatic Weapons. It calls these units "Artillery" not differentiating them from "Field" Artillery, but the distinctive unit insignia they show is definitely from the ADA regimental system, not FA.



"AW" is what gun ADA units were called prior to ADA. Scroll to the bottom of the page.

http://www.ndqsa.com/duster.html

thathaway3
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Michigan, United States
Joined: September 10, 2004
KitMaker: 1,354 posts
Armorama: 537 posts
Posted: Tuesday, January 04, 2011 - 04:44 AM GMT
If your plan is to build as a National Guard vehicle in the MERDC pattern, here's a great link that will help:

http://sites.google.com/site/merdccamo/home/merdc-camouflage-templates

You should try to find a picture of an actual vehicle to be certain about markings.

I'm pretty sure that IF they were applied, the US Star and the USA Numbers would have been in black, but as the Army has gone from plain OD to to MERDC and then the NATO three color schemes, what is and isn't on the vehicle has changed. The most accurate way is to use an actual photo.

One of the problems with references is that in actual practice, soldiers don't always go by the directions.

I'm not sure what you mean by "signal corps". Are you referring to the "Bumper Numbers" which indicate what unit the vehicle is in as well as which vehicle it is?
thathaway3
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Michigan, United States
Joined: September 10, 2004
KitMaker: 1,354 posts
Armorama: 537 posts
Posted: Tuesday, January 04, 2011 - 05:33 AM GMT

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

According to my Order of Battle Vietnam, the "AW" stands for Automatic Weapons. It calls these units "Artillery" not differentiating them from "Field" Artillery, but the distinctive unit insignia they show is definitely from the ADA regimental system, not FA.



"AW" is what gun ADA units were called prior to ADA. Scroll to the bottom of the page.

http://www.ndqsa.com/duster.html





What's really funny to me and a bit of a mystery, is the Distictive Unit Insignia (often erroneously referred to as unit crest) that they show for the 5/2 Artillery on this page.

If you compare the DUIs for the other two units (44th Arty and 60th Arty in Vietnam) to the 44th ADA and 60th ADA, you'll see they are the same, so clearly these were ADA units.

But there's something funny with the 2nd Artillery. If you look up the 2nd ADA, that's not the DUI you will find.

HOWEVER, notice the motto on the bottom "The Second First". Not only is that the same motto as the 2nd FIELD Artillery, but that exact DUI is what members of 1st Bn 2nd Field Artillery were wearing until sometime in late 1971 or 1972 when they switched to the current DUI which depicts an artillery pack mule. The reason I'm aware of this is that I was assigned to 1st Bn, 2nd Field Artillery in Oct 1972, and earlier in the year, I got a welcome letter from the unit on letterhead stationery with the older DUI on it.

So either the 2nd ADA changed their DUI, and 2nd Artillery in Baumholder went from 2nd ADA to 2nd FA, or the unit in Vietnam was actually 2nd FA and THAT unit changed their DUI to the current one.


FlaminPole
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Oklahoma, United States
Joined: March 13, 2007
KitMaker: 102 posts
Armorama: 98 posts
Posted: Tuesday, January 04, 2011 - 02:45 PM GMT
If you can't get the vietnam markings to work, I've got one painted up in the NATO three-color scheme sitting about 500 yards away from my office. While I'm pretty sure these were never actually used in three color, you could do this display piece. Its been 'named' in honor of an old CSM that was part of the brigade at one time (if I'm remembering it correctly)
juge75
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Jasz-Nagkyun-Szolnok, Hungary
Joined: May 02, 2009
KitMaker: 735 posts
Armorama: 733 posts
Posted: Tuesday, January 04, 2011 - 05:15 PM GMT
I checked the page on what you wrote (decal).
It does not reveal whether there is a serial number or other indication other than the inscriptions, but interesting!
Since then, I found a book, I think he will be the final painting (damage to the Vietnamese or photos can not be read or does not seem all that necessary).
Thank you all for your help!
I will post pictures when you're done!
Regards, Gabor.

zapper
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Skĺne, Sweden
Joined: October 18, 2005
KitMaker: 632 posts
Armorama: 623 posts
Posted: Tuesday, January 04, 2011 - 10:30 PM GMT
Perhaps to late but here's two more:



D122 again minus some of the markings on the Osprey paint work you posted Gabor, but with camo instead:


Pictures from http://sitrep1.tripod.com/members_photo_album/index.album/3rd-cavalry-regiment-viet-nam-association-members-photo-album-page?i=0

Cheers,
/E
Cobrahistorian
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Oklahoma, United States
Joined: November 11, 2006
KitMaker: 659 posts
Armorama: 532 posts
Posted: Monday, August 05, 2013 - 02:05 AM GMT
I'm resurrecting this one, having just stumbled across it. The reason there are two separate DUIs for 2nd ADA is as follows:

Headquarters and Headquarters Battery, 2d Artillery Group; 2d, 12th, and 42d Antiaircraft Artillery Battalions; and the 2d Field Artillery Battalion (organized in 1907) onsolidated, reorganized, and redesignated 15 December 1961 as the 2d Artillery, a parent regiment under the Combat Arms Regimental System.

2d Artillery (less former 2d Field Artillery Battalion) reorganized and redesignated 1 September 1971 as the 2d Air Defense Artillery, a parent regiment under the Combat Arms Regimental System (former 2d Field Artillery Battalion concurrently reorganized and redesignated as the 2d Field Artillery – hereafter separate lineage)

Field Artillery and Air Defense Artillery were one branch between 1950 and 1968, and a great deal of cross training was done throughout the branch. Duster and Quad-50 units were designated "Automatic Weapons". In June 1968 the branches split and Air Defense became its own branch and the 2nd Artillery went with ADA. When they reorganized under CARS, the 2nd Artillery Battalion (as indicated above was not part of the 2nd Artillery Regiment) assumed the 2nd Artillery DUI and the 2nd ADA had a new DUI created.

Mark
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Noord-Brabant, Netherlands
Joined: February 07, 2003
KitMaker: 460 posts
Armorama: 368 posts
Posted: Monday, August 05, 2013 - 02:39 AM GMT
Now it's resurrected, in answer to the original question: MecModels do two M42 decal sets!
Yes I now; another shameless plug, can't help it

Mark
Cobrahistorian
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Oklahoma, United States
Joined: November 11, 2006
KitMaker: 659 posts
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Posted: Monday, August 05, 2013 - 03:39 AM GMT
Good to know, since I see a diorama with three 1-44 Dusters in the not-so-distant future!
jwest21
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Pennsylvania, United States
Joined: October 16, 2006
KitMaker: 2,099 posts
Armorama: 1,925 posts
Posted: Monday, August 05, 2013 - 04:07 AM GMT

Quoted Text

Now it's resurrected, in answer to the original question: MecModels do two M42 decal sets!
Yes I now; another shameless plug, can't help it

Mark


and they are fantastic!