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Armor/AFV: Softskins
Softskins group discussions.
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Air Force Special Forces Humvee Questions
niart17
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Joined: October 29, 2008
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Posted: Friday, June 16, 2017 - 05:04 AM GMT+7
Hey guys, I'm feeling a bit like a fish out of water here as I don't do much armor. I was hoping someone here could help me out. I'm working on converting the new Meng 1/24 scale Hummer into a special forces humvee used by the Air Force JTAC teams, I think in Afghanistan. I found some pics online of this vehicle I just felt it's not only really cool, it lends itself to this conversion very well. Does anybody have any more information on the vehicle and perhaps even better, some close up shots of some of the equipment it's outfitted with. I would love to get y'alls input on this. Here are a few pics I found of the vehicle in question. Pretty BAD looking to me.

One thing I did notice (too late) is that this Humvee has the second fuel tank like the civilian H1. I removed the back filler cap because I was under the impression that none of the military Humvee's had a second tank. Well apparently I was wrong as this one clearly has the rear fill cap. Oh well, guess I'll have to rebuild it.









Here are a few shots of my progress so far. Just starting to try to figure out what's what and basic shapes.







Thanks in advance!
Bill
Maki
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ARMORAMA
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Croatia Hrvatska
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Posted: Friday, June 16, 2017 - 08:10 AM GMT+7
Looking good so far. I'm not sure if there's much modern equipment and weapons available in 1/24... I guess you'll have to do some serious scratchbuilding.

Keep us posted on the progress.
Mario
j76lr
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Posted: Friday, June 16, 2017 - 09:10 AM GMT+7
You might be better off building a 1/35th scale . much more stuff available. I was in air force base security , in Viet Nam
glad to see a subject being made of this little known area .
niart17
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Posted: Friday, June 16, 2017 - 11:24 AM GMT+7
Thanks guys. Yes, I realize there's not much out there for 1/24 scale, but for me, that's what makes it all the more appealing. I like doing things that aren't done often. I will scratch build what I can and for the more complicated items, like the M2 and other weapons, I can draw them up in a 3D program and have it printed through Shapeways. Also, to me a Humvee is a pretty small vehicle so 1/35th is just getting too small for my eyes these days. When I was a young punk I could see minutiae details.

And Lou, thank you for your service. My dad was Air Force as well back in Korea. I never really thought about AF special forces other than the pararescue guys. When I ran across these forward controllers, I thought that's cool. And of course now it make total sense to me that they'd be the guys in charge of directing close air support. And from the looks of the equipment they carry and some of the few training videos I've seen of them, they are the real deal. Pretty tough guys doing a tough job.

If anyone has more references on this vehicle it would really help out.

Thanks,
Bill
Trisaw
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Posted: Friday, June 16, 2017 - 02:28 PM GMT+7
Peter Samofalov makes 1/24 weapons and other vehicle accessories on Shapeways.

https://www.shapeways.com/search?q=samofalov&type=

You can obtain a M2HB from Large Scale Armory. Do a search here for the discussion.

http://www.armorama.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=SquawkBox&file=index&req=viewtopic&topic_id=225763&page=1&ord=0

You can see the 1/24 M2HB here.
http://photos.kitmaker.net/showgallery.php?cat=500&ppuser=13678

You want to contact James Banner of Large Scale Armory.

http://www.armorama.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=SquawkBox&file=index&req=viewtopic&topic_id=230432&page=1
niart17
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Posted: Sunday, June 18, 2017 - 03:14 PM GMT+7
Thanks for the info Peter. I prefer to try to model and print my own stuff if possible, just feel like it adds a little more to my sense of accomplishment, and it's fun doing the research and modeling. But if there is anything I don't feel I can tackle well enough I will definitely look up some of those items. Thanks again.

Bill
MikeyBugs95
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Posted: Sunday, June 18, 2017 - 03:45 PM GMT+7
If you need it, Bill, I can scale up the SINCGARS set I did to 1/24 for you.
sgtsauer
#065
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Posted: Sunday, June 18, 2017 - 07:15 PM GMT+7
The vehicle in your photos is an Army Special Forces GMV-S.

Here are photos of a similar GMV-S that I took in Iraq in 2004. Obviously the vehicle in your photos has the side ammunition can racks instead of the side step.

http://www.hmmwvinscale.com/apps/photos/album?albumid=10808755

The vehicle in your photos has the standard HMMWV bucket seats instead of the armored seats in the vehicle I photographed. Although there are some differences, I think my photos will help you finish your interior.

In regards to the dual fuel tanks, those are in use by various vehicles that are expected to go long ranges.
Here is a little bit of information on my site as well.

http://www.hmmwvinscale.com/hmmwvauxfueltank.htm

Notice that the vehicle in your photos has standard issue tires on the vehicle but that they have one 'Super Swamper' tire strapped to the brush guard.

A large majority of the GMV specific components are marketed by Military Systems Group. You can find detailed images of gun mounts, hood BII racks, ammunition racks, etc at http://milsysgroup.com/

Good luck with your project. It will be great to follow this.
niart17
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Posted: Monday, June 19, 2017 - 02:54 AM GMT+7
Hi Brent. Thanks for info! I will check out those links for sure.

When you say it's an Army Special Forces GMV, do you mean that's what it was originally designed for or designated as? Reason I ask is because in some of the pics I've found of this vehicle, you can clearly make out "U.S. Air Force" on the hood with the vehicle number under that. And I think the uniforms the guys around it are wearing are the Air Force's JTAC's. At least that's the information I'm finding on them.

Thanks again for all the help, and a big thanks for your service!

Bill
niart17
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Posted: Monday, June 19, 2017 - 02:58 AM GMT+7

Quoted Text

If you need it, Bill, I can scale up the SINCGARS set I did to 1/24 for you.



Thanks Mike. If I run into any brick walls drawing up what I need I will definitely hit you up for that. Thanks!

Bill
niart17
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Posted: Monday, June 19, 2017 - 04:26 AM GMT+7
I did get a little done on this build over the weekend. I had to scratchbuild the dash and center console as the kit is a civie version and totally different. It's still a little rough but hopefully with some clean-up and paint and gauge decals it will turn out ok. If not I'll just try again.





I realize the center hump is too large and goes too far back but that's the size of the cut-out in the kit and I didn't want to go through the pain of rebuilding the whole floor sections. I think once I get the radio rack and gear in it then it won't be too obvious that its too big. Next I'll have to do the front passenger side of the dash and then detail all the wires, hoses and stuff under both sides. Then the steering column, pedals and more accurate seats and mounts. Then of course all the radio and computer gear. Fun times ahead!

Thanks for checking it out.
Bill
niart17
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Posted: Monday, June 19, 2017 - 05:34 AM GMT+7
Forgot to add, I also did a little work on a figure. Not sure if I'll use it for sure, but just in case he'll have to be fitted out and ready for deployment. I just added a few of the pouches sculpted out of Aves sculpting putty. Still more to do but it's looking close I think.



Bill
JohnTapsell
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Posted: Monday, June 19, 2017 - 06:48 AM GMT+7
Not sure if these are helpful but they were taken back in 2011 and show a USAF Humvee. It's a 'clean' vehicle with no stowage but may be useful


niart17
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Posted: Monday, June 19, 2017 - 07:35 AM GMT+7
Thanks John. They surely do help out. I am of the thought that you can't have too many reference pics. This shows how the bed rails mount up to the roll bar pretty clearly without any stowage in the way. Thanks!
niart17
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Posted: Monday, June 19, 2017 - 07:42 AM GMT+7
And speaking of those bed rails. I noticed in the pics John provided, the rails have some inserts with a bunch of what seem to be tapped holes. In the pic of the vehicle I'm doing, those rails are removed and it looks like in one shot one of those tapped rails has been strapped to the side of the bed rail but not in it's channel. Anyone have any insight as to what their use is and why they would be removed but placed back out of position? Curious.
Maki
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ARMORAMA
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Posted: Monday, June 19, 2017 - 08:18 AM GMT+7
Bill, take a look at Legend GMV offering in 1/35 scale... these images might give you answers. One more thing; Peter Samofalov made some really cool 1/35 scale GMV upgrades and conversions on his Shapeways store. These might prove interesting as a reference as well, and perhaps Peter might want to scale these up for you to 1/24?

https://www.shapeways.com/shops/samofmodels?section=1%2F35+scale&s=0

Cheers,
Mario
Trisaw
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Posted: Monday, June 19, 2017 - 10:19 AM GMT+7
Here are some additional 1/24 rifles from Shapeways...

https://www.shapeways.com/shops/3dscalemodels
firstcircle
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Posted: Monday, June 19, 2017 - 10:59 AM GMT+7
Bill, you might like this ten year old Armorama thread, particularly further down on page 3 there's a nice photo of a vehicle not dissimilar to the one you're interested in.

M1114
niart17
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Posted: Tuesday, June 20, 2017 - 02:51 AM GMT+7
Thanks so much guys! Every little bit of information helps. I hope to have some more done soon. Would love to know exactly what the radio gear and computer configuration is on this particular Humvee. But I guess if I can get it close to reasonable then I'll be ok with that.

Bill
MakiWawa
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Warszawa, Poland
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Posted: Tuesday, June 20, 2017 - 05:13 AM GMT+7
Please find link

http://humvee-models.com/viewtopic.php?f=52&t=545

If you need more information about electronic devices, equipment etc- private message.
vettejack
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Posted: Wednesday, June 21, 2017 - 06:56 AM GMT+7
While in "support" of these 'units' when I was still active duty AF, it was very unlikely, and very much 'frowned upon', that there would be the taking of any kind of photo/film, of any equipment, that went out with and/or possessed by the crews...no matter whether it was for training, or deployment, to 'real world' events. Photos that do show up in military related publications usually appear as a rather generic shot and is usually so 'sanitized' for just such a reason that tries to prevent the chance of even remotely being exposed to such a compromise of 'sensitive' equipment. Don't be too surprised, or disappointed, that perhaps not too many of those photos can be found or obtained. Another example...on any particular mission, there could be opportunities where photos of the crew could be taken in front of their aircraft/vehicle, other times, on that very same mission, no photos were possible/allowed because of the mission/cargo/weaponry/equipment involved with that very same aircraft, at another location, and then usually under the cover of darkness were these vehicles/aircraft then loaded and/or equipped.
niart17
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Posted: Wednesday, June 21, 2017 - 07:37 AM GMT+7
Hi John, First off, thank you very much for your service! Secondly, I totally understand the need for that "vagueness" when it comes to equipment and personnel on these special ops. I would never want to compromise their safety and security. I realize at times the geek modelers in all of us forget the fact that at times there are things we'll never know about and just have to accept that. But that inner geek voice and curiosity about such, lets be honest, "cool things" makes it easy to forget it. I guess what I'm getting at is that if I ask anyone questions here that are "no-no" subjects, please forgive my naivety and just tell me "shaddup"

Bill
niart17
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Posted: Wednesday, June 21, 2017 - 12:57 PM GMT+7
I haven't had a chance to work much on the actual model today but I did get some headway on some 3D model work to get printed. My first part is going to be the M2-HB. I know you guy might could spot some inaccuracy that I probably didn't catch as I am just working off of as many pics I can find, so if you do see something please point it out.



I still have to work on the mount and some smaller details but I think it's getting there.

Thanks,
Bill
niart17
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Posted: Thursday, June 22, 2017 - 11:45 AM GMT+7
ok, so my next question. I've looked around and can't find anything on this. I'm sure I'm just overlooking. As I understand it, the desert tan painted humvees were simply painted tan over the existing green color and weren't factory painted that way. If that's true, how much of the interior and the engine compartment got painted? Would they have simply left the hood on the vehicle and masked the inside of the vents and painted or where they more careful? Would the engine compartment still have green walls with overspray or what? Any help would e much appreciated.

Thanks
Bill
sgtsauer
#065
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Posted: Friday, June 23, 2017 - 06:33 PM GMT+7
Your belief of the painting of the HMMWV's is incorrect. They came from the factory in one of three paint schemes.

1. Overall CARC Green
2. 3-color NATO camouflage
3. Overall CARC Sand

The HMMWV's were contracted for production in lots. The destination of the production lot determined what color the vehicles would be painted in.

Having said that, a vehicle could certainly have been 'over sprayed' but wouldn't have been very common. In Desert Storm, over painted vehicles were very common.

Interiors on all vehicles are green coming out of the factory unless they are overpainted in the field. However, in the case of a configuration such as a M1038 or M1152 where the cargo compartment could be uncovered and visible in the open, it is painted to match the vehicle exterior.