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Armor/AFV
For discussions on tanks, artillery, jeeps, etc.
Monogram sticker shock.
Wierdy
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Ukraine / Україна
Joined: January 26, 2010
KitMaker: 493 posts
Armorama: 476 posts
Posted: Sunday, January 21, 2018 - 11:42 AM GMT+7
...speaking about sticker shock:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Dragon-1-35-6286-Sd-Kfz-181-Pz-Kpfw-VI-Ausf-E-Tiger-I-Initial-Production/181294748488?hash=item2a36025348:g:4FkAAOSwPc9W00pM
I do realise this kit is rare, OOP etc., but it has been superceeded by their own recent releases in terms of accuracy.
Kevlar06
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Washington, United States
Joined: March 15, 2009
KitMaker: 1,420 posts
Armorama: 747 posts
Posted: Thursday, January 18, 2018 - 06:01 AM GMT+7

Quoted Text

....... Business' are not as solid as they appear and the hobby, while in a fantastic golden age of kits, is not as strong in Western culture as it was years ago. Even if the old Monogram molds are long paid for and it is "all profit" to make kits from them, it still costs in material and labor, and those are far more expensive than just the molds.

And Hobby Lobby is more of a wholesale mover of overstock than a real supplier of model kits. Hobby Lobby was at their heyday for models in the late 1990's and early 2000's because they were still moving a glut of kits through from a HUGE failed distributor....




----I used to think this until about a year ago. Then, I noticed the local club membership has increased, in fact we've got several clubs in our area now. Additionally, the number of modelers on line has exponentially increased in the past few years-- there are literally thousands an thousands of us world-wide. A few years ago, before the Internet, the only adult model builders were often labeled as "geeks". But today, it's appealing to a whole new group of individuals-- Doctors, Lawyers, Engineers, Pilots, College professors and even retired Army officers populate the groups I associate with! I think the Internet has cut into the business of the stand alone mom & pop store-- not just in the Hobby world, but everywhere. But I think there is room for innovative brick and mortar stores that use the internet creatively to seek and market. Additionally, I think the sophisticated market among Western society for hobbies in general and models in particular has grown, not declined-- and we can have these discussions among a much wider group of people than we ever could in our LHS. It's true, you can't find many models in the 5 & 10 stores anymore, but then again, there aren't many 5 & 10s around either. It's up to us to bring up the younger generation of modelers in different ways. That's where stores like Hobby Lobby and Hobbytown come in.
VR, Russ
vettejack
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Florida, United States
Joined: November 23, 2012
KitMaker: 814 posts
Armorama: 793 posts
Posted: Thursday, January 18, 2018 - 04:56 AM GMT+7
EBay sees about 90% of my modeling dollars. For what I look for and/or want, it fills just about everything I could ask for. The other 10 percent? Pretty much divided by the manufacturer's website (foreign or domestic) if I'm able to purchase directly from it, and a smattering of time spent at HL pretty much for supplies only. I also shop Lowes/Home Depot/ACE Hardware for the typical disposables (brushes, thinners, wire, etc.) that is used in the hobby: at a much cheaper price, and in greater quantities.
Jacques
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Minnesota, United States
Joined: March 04, 2003
KitMaker: 4,567 posts
Armorama: 4,435 posts
Posted: Thursday, January 18, 2018 - 04:23 AM GMT+7
While it is a very good discussion about how different prices are around the world, one factor has not been discussed...quality. This can be of life, or of service, or of item. I have friends in Ukraine and while cost of living is very low, so is the quality of life. Many times they do not have heat, or water, or hot water. Roads are in poor repair. Housing is very small by American standards.

I have been to Europe. Quality costs there too. Here in America we do have a higher standard of living, with a good chance to get high quality items in our life-time. But there are trade offs.

As for modeling, yeah, prices will be wonky for a while. Business' are not as solid as they appear and the hobby, while in a fantastic golden age of kits, is not as strong in Western culture as it was years ago. Even if the old Monogram molds are long paid for and it is "all profit" to make kits from them, it still costs in material and labor, and those are far more expensive than just the molds.

And Hobby Lobby is more of a wholesale mover of overstock than a real supplier of model kits. Hobby Lobby was at their heyday for models in the late 1990's and early 2000's because they were still moving a glut of kits through from a HUGE failed distributor and large amounts of overstock from the kit makers themselves when kits got overpriced at that time (Italaeri, I am looking at you). Hobby Lobby is kind of like a Dollar store in that regard...if another warehouse liquidates, expect to see a glut of kits flow through all the discount stores again.

Kevlar06
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Washington, United States
Joined: March 15, 2009
KitMaker: 1,420 posts
Armorama: 747 posts
Posted: Thursday, January 18, 2018 - 02:37 AM GMT+7

Quoted Text

Speaking of chain hobby shops...
While doing long term gigs for the Army out of Ft. Lewis, I had to stay in an apartment in Bellevue. The HobbyTown there was surprisingly well stocked, especially with tools.
HobbyTowns are hit or miss. The one one North Academy in Colorado Springs is far better than the one on South Academy. And the Colpar's in Aurora is really nice. Not so much the one in Lakewood, but I'm not sure if that Colpar's is a HobbyTown or not.
But back to Washington, the best one I knew of in your neck of the woods was Bridgetown Hobbies in Sandy, just outside of Portland. Yeah, I know - that's a whole 'nother state, but where I'm from in Texas that's like a Sunday drive. Literally, as Kings Hobbies in Austin is about that far.
Too bad Bridgetown went under. They had a really nice selection of just about everything, including 1/72 nautical items such as a 4 inch gun that's much better than the Revell one in the Gato.



The best two hobby shops in our local area are Skyway Models in Renton, and Georgetown in Seattle. We also have two Hobbytowns, one in Bremerton, one in Tukwila. And then there are three Hobby Lobby's -- Lakewood outside Fort Lewis, Federal Way and Tacoma. I'm not aware of a Hobbytown in Bellevue. The one in Tacoma closed down back in 2011. Bridgetown was good, but as you said, a long way to drive, and they weren't as good as Skyway. We've lost about ten hobby shops in the area over the years, our local model RR shop closed just this last year (probably due to mismanagement more than anything) for various reasons (I used to work at one in University Place, until the owner died, and his executor ran it out of business). But there's always the box stores and the two good ones we have left.
VR, Russ
Armored76
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Bayern, Germany
Joined: September 30, 2013
KitMaker: 1,542 posts
Armorama: 1,427 posts
Posted: Thursday, January 18, 2018 - 01:12 AM GMT+7

Quoted Text

parcels take between 4 months and 9 months to arrive even if sent by international registeted express mail



...and here I am getting upset if the parcel is not delivered the next day after it has been sent. Waiting 2-3 weeks for deliveries from the UK feels like eternity. Such posts really put this in a perspective!
Vierville
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Gauteng, South Africa
Joined: April 05, 2014
KitMaker: 211 posts
Armorama: 200 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 - 06:11 PM GMT+7
Wayne, yeah the shop at Menlyn (Jix Hobbies) is very good. They carry quite a wide range of supplies and some nice kits.

Dragon ,Hasegawa and Eduard models are for the most part not available at all here apparently due to the fact that these companies will only ship large quantities (shipping container sized orders!)and there isn't sufficient demand in the country.

I have found some gems at toy stores too...very unexpected but a pleasant surprise.
18Bravo
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Colorado, United States
Joined: January 20, 2005
KitMaker: 5,849 posts
Armorama: 4,906 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 - 04:29 PM GMT+7
Speaking of chain hobby shops...
While doing long term gigs for the Army out of Ft. Lewis, I had to stay in an apartment in Bellevue. The HobbyTown there was surprisingly well stocked, especially with tools.
HobbyTowns are hit or miss. The one one North Academy in Colorado Springs is far better than the one on South Academy. And the Colpar's in Aurora is really nice. Not so much the one in Lakewood, but I'm not sure if that Colpar's is a HobbyTown or not.
But back to Washington, the best one I knew of in your neck of the woods was Bridgetown Hobbies in Sandy, just outside of Portland. Yeah, I know - that's a whole 'nother state, but where I'm from in Texas that's like a Sunday drive. Literally, as Kings Hobbies in Austin is about that far.
Too bad Bridgetown went under. They had a really nice selection of just about everything, including 1/72 nautical items such as a 4 inch gun that's much better than the Revell one in the Gato.
Lakota
#123
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New Mexico, United States
Joined: November 17, 2008
KitMaker: 746 posts
Armorama: 421 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 - 02:21 PM GMT+7
Howdy Y'all
Interesting conversation, I just picked up a 1/48 Tamiya M1A2 at Hobby Lobby today for about $23.00 including sales tax and 40% off coupon; for me, a splurge. I usually don't buy new kits and use the LHS and HL for paints and supplies. The selection at Hobby Lobby is quite poor since they cut down on the number of kits they stock.
I usually get my kits for less off EBay or pick them up at swap meets. Better yet, I can usually dig something out of the stash. My stash has become sort of an "investment" for retirement, that's my story and I'm sticking to it.
Take care,
Don "Lakota"
landshark4
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Alabama, United States
Joined: June 04, 2012
KitMaker: 85 posts
Armorama: 73 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 - 01:45 PM GMT+7
Spent two years in the DRCongo so you can imagine what that was like trying to have this hobby. Going to South Africa a couple of times didn't help much because like you said stuff was expensive. But it was nice to see that one hobby shop by Medellin mall in Pretoria. Didn't think the selection of stuff was that bad.
Bravo1102
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New Jersey, United States
Joined: December 08, 2003
KitMaker: 1,808 posts
Armorama: 1,564 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 - 01:39 PM GMT+7
Wasn't that long ago when all packages took six to eight weeks for delivery and overseas considerably longer. Ordering something from Asia meant waiting for a slow boat and back and forth with Eastern Europe was measured in months.

We take so much for granted. But then back in those days toy stores carried Tamiya, each local discount store had an entire aisle of plastic models and I had three or four LHS to choose from. Now it's all internet and mail order. I understand so well how much we need to be grateful for.
TopSmith
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Washington, United States
Joined: August 09, 2002
KitMaker: 909 posts
Armorama: 859 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 - 01:13 PM GMT+7
Paul, I totally agree with you and I am as guilty as most others in not appreciating what we have and what others are missing.

Mark, I meant model kits in general cost more when I mentioned Dragon and Tiger Models, not that HL carried them.
d6mst0
#453
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Texas, United States
Joined: August 28, 2016
KitMaker: 289 posts
Armorama: 173 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 - 10:59 AM GMT+7

Quoted Text

I was at Hobby Lobby today and saw a Monogram Pzkfw IV. I thought it might be a fun build. It has been 40 years sence I last built a Monogram tank. Wow, it was the same price as Tamiya's Easy Eight Sherman. I was thinking it was in the 20's, not $50. I ended up leaving it on the shelf. I have noticed that kit prices have moved up. Some of the Dragon kits are at the $80 mark and others like Tiger Models are more. Ugh.



Wow your Hobby Lobby has Dragon kits! The one by my house does not. The H.L. store only sells Revel and Tamiya kits and maybe a few Monogram and Academy kits. Most of those are from 1970's castings.
Wierdy
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Ukraine / Україна
Joined: January 26, 2010
KitMaker: 493 posts
Armorama: 476 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 - 10:58 AM GMT+7
Some people just like whining thinking they don't have enough services, too high prices or insufficient attitude. This world is not the same: for me the prices in the US are ridiculously low in comparison to what people earn. Shipping speed is in the same rank. In some areas receiving one parcel out of five is a good luck. Think about it and you will have more positive emotions.
urumomo
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Texas, United States
Joined: August 22, 2013
KitMaker: 622 posts
Armorama: 614 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 - 10:41 AM GMT+7
I think the mail to you ran faster in the 19th century - no ?
Surprised you have internet :-)
Removed by original poster on 01/17/18 - 15:37:33 (GMT).
Vierville
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Gauteng, South Africa
Joined: April 05, 2014
KitMaker: 211 posts
Armorama: 200 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 - 10:33 AM GMT+7
I rather generously did not mention that if your parcel does not arrive after about 9 months, you can consider it lost forever...
urumomo
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Texas, United States
Joined: August 22, 2013
KitMaker: 622 posts
Armorama: 614 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 - 09:46 AM GMT+7

Quoted Text

(parcels take between 4 months and 9 months to arrive even if sent by international registeted express mail)




Dude !
What ??!
Vierville
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Gauteng, South Africa
Joined: April 05, 2014
KitMaker: 211 posts
Armorama: 200 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 - 09:32 AM GMT+7
For me, the cost of the model is not the issue, it's the shipping that kills me.

One decent Dragon or Rye Field model costs maybe 4hrs work earnings but the shipping is often double or triple the cost of the model. South Africa has an almost nonexistant postal system (parcels take between 4 months and 9 months to arrive even if sent by international registeted express mail) so the likes of UPS or FedEx are the only way of making sure your order will arrive...

LHSs are OK here but have a very poor selection of kits. Supplies such as paints and weathering materials can be bought here but at a very high price.

Kevlar06
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Washington, United States
Joined: March 15, 2009
KitMaker: 1,420 posts
Armorama: 747 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 - 05:32 AM GMT+7
Robin,
I never go to any LHS without running errands to other places. In this case I'm about 10 miles from one store, 6 from another, and the last (the Federal Way store) I'm about 18 miles from. But for me, the first two stores are directly on the path to my local medical care, my wife's hair salon, (I drop her there and I go elsewhere for a couple hours) and the occasional restaurant or other store we might visit. Hobby Lobby is a massive "box store" for all kinds of hobby items from floral arranging to sewing, to oil painting, all under one roof, so if a family member is interested in something else, it's a convenient stop. I do have three very well stocked LHS within about 25 miles, and I'll occasionally visit them, more for conversing with other modelers, but often for sales-- they all frequently run 20% and 50% off sales for many items. But fortunately for me, all these shops are on the way to someplace else! By the way, I knew Al Superczynski-- who I met at one of those local hobby shops a few years before he passed away.
VR, Russ
RobinNilsson
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Stockholm, Sweden
Joined: November 29, 2006
KitMaker: 2,696 posts
Armorama: 2,406 posts
Posted: Tuesday, January 16, 2018 - 09:05 PM GMT+7

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

The Hobby Lobby That had the Panzer 4 at $49.95 had the Monogram Patton for $20 something. So maybe it was a miss pricing. I did look and all the Panzer 4's were at the incorrect price. Russ, it was the one in Lakewood.



Greg-- hmm-- I've found the one in Tacoma to be the offending one the most often, but I have noticed differences at Lakewood too. But it goes to show they have variances from store to store. I'm going to try the Federal Way Hobby Lobby some day and see what thier prices are like.
VR, Russ



How much time and petrol would you spend on checking for the best price in all these stores?
Just curious ...
/ Robin
Kevlar06
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Washington, United States
Joined: March 15, 2009
KitMaker: 1,420 posts
Armorama: 747 posts
Posted: Tuesday, January 16, 2018 - 05:49 PM GMT+7

Quoted Text

The Hobby Lobby That had the Panzer 4 at $49.95 had the Monogram Patton for $20 something. So maybe it was a miss pricing. I did look and all the Panzer 4's were at the incorrect price. Russ, it was the one in Lakewood.



Greg-- hmm-- I've found the one in Tacoma to be the offending one the most often, but I have noticed differences at Lakewood too. But it goes to show they have variances from store to store. I'm going to try the Federal Way Hobby Lobby some day and see what thier prices are like.
VR, Russ
Bravo1102
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New Jersey, United States
Joined: December 08, 2003
KitMaker: 1,808 posts
Armorama: 1,564 posts
Posted: Tuesday, January 16, 2018 - 04:58 PM GMT+7

Quoted Text

The Hobby Lobby That had the Panzer 4 at $49.95 had the Monogram Patton for $20 something. So maybe it was a miss pricing. I did look and all the Panzer 4's were at the incorrect price. Russ, it was the one in Lakewood.


I saw that happen back when I was in retail. An item would come in with the wrong invoice price and you have to put it out at that price and request a price adjustment. As for different pricing in different departments-- in large retailers that can be because of different buyers. One buyer gets an accessory for his department for a better price point. It happens. It'd be up to a department manager to notice and get a price adjustment so all departments have the same item for the same price.

But people just don't pay attention to detail or retail for that matter.
TopSmith
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Washington, United States
Joined: August 09, 2002
KitMaker: 909 posts
Armorama: 859 posts
Posted: Tuesday, January 16, 2018 - 02:51 PM GMT+7
The Hobby Lobby That had the Panzer 4 at $49.95 had the Monogram Patton for $20 something. So maybe it was a miss pricing. I did look and all the Panzer 4's were at the incorrect price. Russ, it was the one in Lakewood.
urumomo
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Texas, United States
Joined: August 22, 2013
KitMaker: 622 posts
Armorama: 614 posts
Posted: Tuesday, January 16, 2018 - 01:46 PM GMT+7
Another thing about Hobby Lobby is they will have the same item priced differently in different areas of the store .
Like an Excel hobby knife for 4.99 by the plastic kits , but the same knife for 3.99 over by the scales and templates etc etc .
So -
You see they still use pricing guns and items are rung up by price and dept , they can't scan anything to find the price --- how they manage inventory of what's coming and going is beyond me