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Armor/AFV: Large Scale
1/16 and Larger Armor Modeling
Hosted by Darren Baker
Amazing T-34 model part 2
colo_artist
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Colorado, United States
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Posted: Friday, October 29, 2004 - 03:58 AM UTC

Quoted Text


[snip]
Wonder what that pump there in front of the motor attaches onto? The motor or the firewall? I doubt if it sits on the floor.
[snip]

Take care, Larry



It certainly gave me a different perspective on my modeling abilities.

Are you referring to the valve with a handle and tubing he modeled...the one where the cut out is on the removable panel?

I've seen it on a number of T-34 pictures. I believe it's to control the oil flow from the side tanks to the engine. Possibly to allow shutting off the flow from the tanks while the engine warms up. Does anyone know for sure?

Anyway, if that's the one, it stays right where it's at. Here's a reference picture...


From this page...http://www.kmk-scaleworld.be/WalkAround/CDTZCH/34/index.html

Karl
sgirty
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Posted: Friday, October 29, 2004 - 10:39 AM UTC
Hi, Yes, that's the pump unit. Gives me a clearner picture of it. Looks good, thanks.

I borke down and ordered both the /76 and /85 resin ammo today from Great Models, and while I was at it, I also got their #12 issue of the AFV Modeller, just to check it out. If it's good, I'll get a subscription to it, and it seems to be a lot cheaper than MMiR.

I cut out the center of the firewall tonight and ended up breaking the wall itself down to the bottom. Oh well, was planning to make a new one anyway, more in line with the /42's looks. It shouldn't be to hard of a thing to do (I hope), just cutting off and sanding down any detail on the kit 's firewall that should go on the /42, and adding it in the approproate places, and drilling some new holes, again in the appropriate places, as they should be as well. Also there's that internal fume and smoke thingy too to add to the rear side by those mg racks.

Looks like there's going to be another trip to the local hobby shop tomorrow. Kind of look for some excuse to go up there on Saturdays anyway. Ha, ha!

Take care, Larry
MCR
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Arizona, United States
Joined: July 15, 2004
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Posted: Saturday, October 30, 2004 - 05:28 AM UTC

Quoted Text


The wingnuts, although nice, are simply humungo..



Are we speaking the wing nuts that hold the brackets that secure the panels? If we are then they really should be there.
This is supported by photos of the APG Model '42, the Littlefield "Model '43", and contemporary photographs of the Model '42s sent to the US and UK for evaluation during the war.
As well as the removable panels on the firewall, the round hatch on the upper center panel is also secured by a wing nut in all of my reference photos.

OK, if I've jumped in where I a) didn't understand what detail the post was referring to or b) where I wasn't wanted, simply call me an idiot and I'll be on my marry way

Dave's build is very well done and he's obviously had some very good reference photos to work from. It would appear to me that he's based his firewall on an illustration in one of the 1944 dated service manuals. This is not a criticism of Dave’s work but in using this illustration (if he did) he ended up with the radiator louver controls (the levers on either side of the central panel) somewhat lower and much further out to the sides than they should be.
This really does not detract in any way from his finish work which is the best I've seen yet.
colo_artist
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Posted: Saturday, October 30, 2004 - 09:00 AM UTC
Oh, hey there Mark...I just sent you an email. Good to see you here.

I'm new with this Russian stuff and will certainly defer to your expertise. My case against the wingnuts was probably overstated. "A bit oversized" is probably a better description than "humongo."

The kit's wingnuts look to be about 3/16" to me. Which, naturally, would be equal to 3" on a real one. Are they actually that big?

Bus
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Sao Paulo, Brazil
Joined: December 11, 2003
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Posted: Saturday, October 30, 2004 - 09:33 AM UTC
WOW!!No words make your model justice!!Really amazing,man!Tons of details everywhere!Congrats and keep the pics coming!
sgirty
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Posted: Saturday, October 30, 2004 - 02:28 PM UTC
Hi, Here's an interesting question that may or may not have been covered before. I put what I've heard is the vent lever, F16-17, up front just behind the driver on the side panel, after some major surgery to the pieces, and now I going to fit a long rod on this going back through the firewall. Now, just how far back beyond the fire wall would this 'rod' go? Anybody seen any references to this? If it is indeed a 'vent' opening lever, would it go all the way back to the 2 rearward main vents,G3 that are under the rear panel, G-16. Just curious here.

Spent around an hour today up to the hobby store sorting through that big R.R. catalog they have until we finally came up with a set of plastic nuts of the size I need to put on the outer side of the ice cleats when they are attached to the tracks. Didn't know such a small, seemingly simple thing could get so complicated. But in the end, I did get some of the apporpriate size ordered for that little detail. Also picked up some .040 plastic sheet to try my hand at a new firewall. Am going to leave the wing nuts on the pieces I cut off of the old firewall and looks like I'm going to have to find some more to put across the top of the center panel as well. Back to that big catalog!!!!

Spent some time today adding most of the road wheels, idlers, drive sprokect and such, plus putting the track links together and fitting them on to see how it all looked. This thing is finally starting to look a little like a tank now. Ha, ha! Still a long way to go though. The hardest part is going to be that area around the driver's station and just how much of the extra detail I can do that I've seen done by other modelers in this area.

Take care, Larry.
colo_artist
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Posted: Sunday, October 31, 2004 - 12:48 AM UTC
Larry...yup, it goes all the way back to the rear vents, G3. The Short Service Manual shows it...


Fullsized image: http://www.gjames.com.au/chris/t34/img/service-plate3-l.gif
...on this page: http://www.gjames.com.au/chris/t34/t34-service-1.html

For bolt heads, I found this page to have a good description of some interesting ways to build some...
http://cidwebs.com/armorinscale/rivets.htm

If you're making a bunch and have the money ($50-$100), it looks like a tap and die set would be the ticket. Here's a review of one...
http://www.armorama.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Reviews&file=index&req=showcontent&id=78

However the article doesn't mention what I use. It's a little metal plate with hex-shaped holes which you fill with melted sprue. Here's a pic...


It works well. Just stick some melted sprue in the hole and trim off with a razor. However, it was designed for smaller scale models in mind. The largest hole is just slightly smaller than those big bolts on the rear panel..P2. But those are huge. The tool would work to replicate all the other bolts in the kit.

The Greif tool is $15 (Canadian). If you're interested, go their main page and click on "Greif" in the left hand menu...
http://www.trackjam.com/

sgirty
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Posted: Sunday, October 31, 2004 - 02:41 AM UTC
Hi, A big thank you colo_artist for that information. I had a feeling that this rod did go all the way back, but just wasn't sure. There's been so much information posted on this vehicle, most of it thanks to you, that I am tending to forget what is out there and what isn't. I'll chalk that up to the age thing, as this process of getting older is something I'm having a real hard time adjusting to anymore. Ha, ha!

The Greif bolt head maker looks interesting. I picked up the bolt head-caat washer set to add the ice cleats to the tracks for $3 for a hundred of them, so this is a pretty good deal. Also got 100 HOcale 'bolt-washer-nut' plasitc casting for $3 for a 100 as well. These will work to replace those little bolt heads I shaved off of the side panels when I added the plastic sheet to cover up those 'dents' on parts D-3 and -4. Also used one of them to attach the little end of that vent rod to the handle and it seemed to look pretty good, scale wise. I'm pretty sure that these panels didn't show any 'bolts' on them, but may decide to add them anyway, so as to collect a little wash and weathering.

Am having kind of a time getting some eye-hooks big enough for 1/16 scale to add to the trans. and motor. Did get a dozen of them at the hobby store last week, and they look okay, but once installed they are just a tad too small. The R.R. catalog does have another set of various sizes and shapes of eye-rings, again, $3 for 100 of them, but they cover all kinds of styles used by the railroads during various historical periods, so some will work and some won't. Am considering this option on the /85 kit.

I set the /42 kit beside the completed /43 kit today and man, they are both impressive models, even with my less than good modeling skills. The hobby store owner whats me to bring the /43 up so he can put it in one of his display cases to help stimulate the sales of this large kit come Xmas time, and after viewing what I've done so far on the /42, he wants this one up there as well. That sort of gives me a vote of confidence that some of my work is better than what I think it is. Guess we are our own worst critics. I can see so many mistakes on both of them.

Anyway, I am slowly moving along. Next big step is trying to do one of those new firewall bulkheads. This, and all that stuff I would like to add to the driver's area are the current big challenges.

I got out that new 1/35 scale 3-in-1 German halftrack kit from Dragon the other night and did some serious looking over of the parts and instructions. Man, I can't believe the size of those parts. Holy Crap are they small!!!!!!!! 1/16 does tend to spoil a person.

Again, thanks for all the information.

Take care. Larry.
MCR
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Arizona, United States
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Posted: Sunday, October 31, 2004 - 04:42 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Oh, hey there Mark...I just sent you an email. Good to see you here.

I'm new with this Russian stuff and will certainly defer to your expertise. My case against the wingnuts was probably overstated. "A bit oversized" is probably a better description than "humongo."

The kit's wingnuts look to be about 3/16" to me. Which, naturally, would be equal to 3" on a real one. Are they actually that big?




OK, I understand now. You are right, the wing nuts are way too large. If I recall correctly I mesured them out at a bit more than 1 1/4" across (maybe as much as 1 1/2"?)

Go ahead and try the email again at : Byrule303@direcway.com

Mark
sgirty
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Posted: Sunday, October 31, 2004 - 12:56 PM UTC
Hi, Posted some new photos in the gallery of as far as I got on the interior today. The firewall part is about half done. Had to cut and fit and cut and fit, even using the kit part as a pattern, until I finally got one I was satisfied with in it's overall fit. Am cutting off and sanding down some molded pieces on the kit wall to add to it.

Haven't decided if I am going to leave the center section off yet or not. I know I will have to add an upper support across this open space for looks and to add the fuel piping on the back if I leave the center section off. And I will have to add that oil pump thingy to the front of the motor as well.

Made the vent lever rod today as well, but can't really install this until I have the firewall all done and finished. Added a couple of supports on the wall to support the rod as it goes to the rear too.

The upper hull looks kind of messy, what with that MIlliput here and there, but it looks better 'in the flesh' so to speak, than it shows up on the pictures. The turret looked the same way before it was cleaned up and painted.

Am burned out for the day and think I will let it set for a couple of days, but I know it will call to me. "Finish me now. Finish me now." Ha, ha!

Did some work on the Dragon 1/35 halftrack today as well, and am now remembering that Dragon's instructions leave something to be desired. ha! Good kits, sorry instructions.

Take care, Larry
colo_artist
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Posted: Monday, November 01, 2004 - 12:17 PM UTC
Metal barrels...



Today was a metal barrel day for me. A package from Japan arrived containing a FineMolds T-34-85 barrel. I bought it from Hobby World International:
http://hobbyworld.aoshima-bk.co.jp/eindex.asp

I just checked, but they look to be sold out. I see RainbowTen is out of the T-34-76 barrels, but still has the T-34-85's in stock...
http://www.rainbowten.co.jp/

That's all moot since today was also the first day I found a US supplier for the FineMolds barrels...Mission Models...
http://www.missionmodels.com/

The T-34-76 is $25, the T-34-85 goes for $35. Here's the specific page...
http://www.missionmodels.com/pages/fine_moldsarmour.htm

I called them and found they do have them in stock and that they believe they are the only US supplier to carry them. They also said the supply is limited to what they have in stock and won't have any more unless FineMolds does another run. I ordered one for one of my T-34-76's

FYI...I also ordered issue #18 of AFV Modeller ($18) and pre-ordered the T-34 laden issue #19 ($19).

I also have metal barrels from Brass Barrels...
http://brassbarrels.com/

They have one made out of brass for the T-34-76 ($19) on their web site. They don't have one on their site for the T-34-85, but, I think it's the same guy, selling them for the 85 on eBay for a buy-it-now price of $28.

How do they compare? Well, all of the barrels are well made. The FineMolds barrels have rifling inside the tip, but are only drilled out about 1/4". The ones from Brass Barrels don't have rifling, but are bored all of the way through.

My recommendation...if you want to have a rather rare item on your T, go for the FineMolds, but it's neat to be able to see light through the Brass Barrels ones.

Let's see, some links...here's a review of the FineMolds by Terry Ashley at PMMS...
http://pmms.webace.com.au/reviews/vehicles/finemolds/sp09.htm

...and the FineMolds site...
http://www.sala.or.jp/%7Efm/sp10/85.htm

majorproblem
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England - West Midlands, United Kingdom
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Posted: Tuesday, November 02, 2004 - 11:41 AM UTC
ALL these months I have been using the tanxheaven website and I never realised it was a modelling site!!!!!! .......thought it was just reference pictures!

That guys work on the T-34 is an absoloute masterpiece, just fantastic!

Carl
colo_artist
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Posted: Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 03:04 AM UTC
I still haven't heard anything new on the release date of the book from AirConnection "T-34 Mythical Weapon" by Robert Michulec. It's 300 pgs, 1000 b&w and color photos. 1/35 drawings, 15 pages in color.

However, I did find a site with the best (pre-order) price I've seen...$67.45. It's at Great Models...


http://www.greatmodels.com/
http://www.greatmodels.com/cgi/display.cgi?item_num=air01

If you want to go directly to the source, here's the link for AirConnection...
http://www.airconnection.on.ca/
http://www.airconnection.on.ca/T-34%20the%20book.htm

They are selling it for $74.99 (pre-order) and $84.99 after publication. Their page has a more complete description and pictures.

VLS also carries it for the full price of $84.99...
http://www.modelmecca.com/

MrMox
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Posted: Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 03:51 AM UTC
My "little" T34/76 dio got a 3. place - accidently I bought a T34/85 at the show....
colo_artist
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Colorado, United States
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Posted: Thursday, November 11, 2004 - 04:06 PM UTC
AFV Modeller #19 is out. It features David Parker's astounding build of two T-34-76s plus three reference photo articles. I preordered mine from Mission Models and the magazine arrived yesterday. WOW!...



http://www.missionmodels.com/pages/afvmag.htm

sgirty
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Posted: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 - 10:16 AM UTC
Hi, Posted some photos in the gallery of my 1/16 scale Trumpeter T-34/42 as it slowly comes along. Due to some other committments (there always seems to be something or someone taking my time anymore), I haven't gotten much of a change to work on this thing here lately. Seems like I've been building this thing for 3 or 4 months now. I have!!!!!! It still will take another month or so till I think I'll be on the home stretch, I think, or I hope.

Been trying out a lot of new things on this one, scratchbuilding certain things and such. Some have come out not too bad and some not too good, but we all have to start someplace I guess. Thankfully this big kit provides the space I need to add some things here and there that I would never have attempted on the smaller scales, and it has been a real neat experince all in all.The kit so far looks a little naked now without any personality added with the various oil washes and other weathering effects. Hopefully this will help to tie things together more.

Take care, Sgirty
colo_artist
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Posted: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 - 11:53 AM UTC
New T-34 engine pictures posted on Tanxheaven site. The engine pics at the top of the page have been there for a bit, but there is a new set at the bottom.



http://tanxheaven.com/ludob/t34engine/t34enginelb.htm

What I noticed in these pictures are the dented exhaust manifolds. I thought they were cast, but clearly they're stamped. Oh man, that thing must have been ungodly noisy. It must have sounded just like a...well, uh...tank.
colo_artist
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Posted: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 - 01:36 PM UTC
Hey Sgirty, nice looking tank you've got there. I like what you've done with the scratchbuilt firewall...especially the added fan.

Well, you're a speed demon compared to me...but everyone is. I'm still working on the firewall. Here's a pic (there are a couple more in my gallery)...



I used this for the pattern...



This page was also great for details of the firewall...



http://tanxheaven.com/ludob/t34-85/t34-85.htm

Take care...Karl
sgirty
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Posted: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 - 02:22 PM UTC
Hi. Thanks Karl. The most interesting part I've made would have to be those springs on the control levers there. I thought they would be really hard, but they weren't too bad. Just rapped some small wire around a brass rod and it all came out pretty good after a couple of tries. Didn't try to hook all those controls up under the driver's seat though. That was just WAY too much for me to try. (And quite frankly I'm getting a little tired of this thing. But I know that if I put it back and go to another kit, just for something different, it will never get done, and I don't want that to happen. Too much time invested in it now.)

Yes, I would imagine we would all be surprised as just how slip-shod the real vehicles were coming out of the factories, much less what condition they were kept in the field.

I think you are doing outstanding work on your model. I really like that scratch-built firewall. You've put in a trememdous amount of work in your model so far. Excellent workmanship! Really. It's going to be a real stunner when it's all done!

By the metal thinckness of the fire wall in the photo you posted, it almost looks like the same general thickness as the sheet metal used on the fenders!

I would have to think that an internal conmmunications set in this vehicle would be kind of a wasted item.

I see that the modeler on the tanxheaven site added a piece of sheet plastic to the inside front of the glacis. Looks kind of nice. Am trying to cut out something similar for mine. Of course it won't be seen, but I think it adds something to the kit looking in from the outside. Or not.

Take care, Larry
colo_artist
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Posted: Sunday, November 28, 2004 - 05:43 AM UTC
I just noticed some new pictures on the Tanxheaven page I just mentioned...the one with the firewall pictures. The new pictures show just how rough the casted turrets can be, contrasting greatly with the smooth hull plates.



The pics are way down at the bottom of this page...

http://tanxheaven.com/ludob/t34-85/t34-85.htm

Karl
sgirty
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Posted: Monday, November 29, 2004 - 04:22 AM UTC
HI Karl, Man that's ROUGH, ain't no doubt about it there! Don't think I have seen a photo of one rougher than that yet! It looks almost like a safety hazard just to crawl around in the darn thing! Sure wouldn't do much for the clothes.

But "roughness' is something, esp. on Russian vehicles that we have to be aware of.

This is something that has been on my mind lately anyway. Just how 'rough' can these T-34s be made? Not only on the outside, but the inside as well. Esp. if they have been 're-conditioned' in the field after combat. There are plenty of photos out showing what these things looked like on the outside, but I just wonder about the inside. I'm thinking about a stage beyond simple the paint chipping, mud splatters, scratches and scrapes.

Take care, Larry
sgirty
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Posted: Monday, November 29, 2004 - 04:27 AM UTC
HI, Karl: Did you check out that box that the builder made for the front end there on tanxheaven? It's great, even including the cleaning rods. I imagine these started off as those rounded tooth picks. Great stuff.

Got my interior of the /42 pretty well done, weathering and all. Need to get some photos taken here in another day or so.

Take care, Larry
seyahmit
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Posted: Monday, November 29, 2004 - 07:10 AM UTC
Hey everyone, it has been a while since I last posted and worked on my tank. As a matter of fact, my T-34 has been sitting on the shelf while I have been in aircraft model mode. I go on stretches where I work on either armor or aircraft models, never mixing the two. As soon as I get my Trumpeter P-40 built, I need to get back to work on the T-34 and Leopold to make room for the Karl that (:-) will be bringing.

It's nice to see more reference matierial for the T-34. Some of it would have been nice a few months ago! :-)
MrMox
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Posted: Monday, December 06, 2004 - 09:48 PM UTC
Just seen this on the Verlinden homepage:



Splinty2001
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Michigan, United States
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Posted: Tuesday, December 07, 2004 - 04:27 AM UTC
Now if only Verlinden would come out with some 85mm rounds for the late war crowd....