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Armor/AFV
For discussions on tanks, artillery, jeeps, etc.
IJA Type 1 75mm SPG colors
Kencelot
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Posted: Wednesday, February 20, 2002 - 11:04 AM UTC
Okay guys, after quite awhile of trying to get my brother to start the hobby again...success!!!
(Very exciting for me) Anyway, he's starting on the above mentioned and is looking for a way out of doing the typical four-color pattern on Japanese tanks. Does anyone with reference material have anything which tells or shows a single color which may have been used on their tanks????
After an extensive search on the www, I come up with next to nill, except for one pic, which is located at (unknown) museum showing a dark green paint job. Because I lack ( as well as this pic) any proof or non-proof as to the use of this color on the tank. It may have been repainted????
Any help here would be greatly appreciated by myself as well as he. TIA.

Who knows maybe after some more bugging, he'll join us here... :-)
Kencelot
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Posted: Thursday, February 21, 2002 - 04:22 AM UTC
WHAT!!!????? Nothing...eeeek!!
You mean to tell me that none of you with all those piles of references has nothing on this??? Ack! EEEEeeeeek.
What a bummer, I think I lost a potential re-enlisted modeler!
GunTruck
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Posted: Thursday, February 21, 2002 - 04:24 AM UTC
Ken - give me a chance to go home and rut around the reference shelves... :-) The rest of the guys are quiet because they don't wanna overwhelm anyone with a dirth of IJN knowlege :-)

Gunnie
Kencelot
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Posted: Thursday, February 21, 2002 - 04:33 AM UTC
Thanks Gunnie, I knew another (whining one at that) post would get some results. hehehe

It's unbelievable the wealth of information on the IJA out there...lol
Seriously though, it is quite a dry field.?
GunTruck
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Posted: Thursday, February 21, 2002 - 04:35 AM UTC
It is - talked about an unloved armor subject. WW II Italian tanks get more air-time than IJN tanks! :-)

Gunnie
Kencelot
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Posted: Thursday, February 21, 2002 - 04:42 AM UTC
Quite humbling for me. Usually I can find next to ANYTHING via the web. But when my brother called me last night and asked me the question, I said "sure, give me a minuet or two and I'll have something for you". Wow, was I mistaken! I'll be more carefull next time.
BTW, that by no means I will accept defeat on this matter. I will still search...on and on...
arawata
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Posted: Thursday, February 21, 2002 - 04:49 AM UTC
Try this site for Japanese armour info - no colour shots or camo colour descriptions unfortunately.

http://member.nifty.ne.jp/takixxx/

Andrew
Kencelot
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Posted: Thursday, February 21, 2002 - 05:44 AM UTC
Thanks Andrew, I found that one last night. Is a bummer with no colors information.
Thanks again.
GunTruck
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Posted: Thursday, February 21, 2002 - 10:05 PM UTC
Kencelot - I looked all around last night for IJN stuff - no success. I'll keep lookin though...

Gunnie
HunterCottage
#116
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Posted: Friday, February 22, 2002 - 02:48 AM UTC
Kencelot,

I don't know if it helps any at all, but I got out my Humbrol "The colour system" folder earlier today for another post. I have colors for the Japanese Air Force, but I don't know if they would be the same colors used on Armor...

Silver A6 Hum 191
Grey A/N2 interblend Hum 34, 94 parts; 27, 5 parts; 186, 1 part
Green A3 interblend Hum 101, 27 parts; 186, 9 parts; 25, 9 parts
Mauve N9 interblend Hum 94, 7 parts;34, 7 parts; 25, 6 parts; 60, 3 parts
Brown N17 interblend Hum 24, 21 parts; 80, 9 parts;60, 4 parts
Green N1 interblend Hum 77, 7 parts;80, 1 part; 33, 1 part;34, 1 part

as I said I don't have any idea if this help out any!!
Kencelot
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Posted: Friday, February 22, 2002 - 04:15 AM UTC
Hey, thanks guys. We're getting there. Sooner or later some diffinitive information will turn up. Thanks for your time.
HunterCottage
#116
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Posted: Friday, February 22, 2002 - 11:06 PM UTC
Alas!! I think I have found something!!

From an e-mail I got back on the subject:
Dear Brian,

Type 1 75mm SPG was painted by the IJA color schemes. As for the IJA color schemes, refer to the enclosed document. Type 1 75mm SPGs in the Philippines and Burma were probably painted in the southern area color scheme.

Regards,

Taki

The enclosed file was the following:

The article:
Camouflage pattern and insignia of Imperial Japanese Army Armoured
Unit Written by Kunihiro Suzuki, Finemold Armour Modeling Vol.2

Paintings by official camouflage document
1) "TUTIKUSA-IRO"(Light brown) is the main color of camouflage, and
fits to all season. Its reflectance is approximately 8.4%.
2) "TUCHI-IRO"(Dark brown) is the darkest color for camouflage, and
matches to dark background, such as forest or black soil. and Dark
brown has the effect which looks like collapse by illusion. Its
reflectance is approximately 4.5%.
3) "KAREKUSA-IRO"(khaki) is the brightest color for camouflage, matches
to the bright background, such as dry grass field. Its reflectance is
approximately 15%.
4) "KUSA-IRO"(dark green) matches to the spring and summer, and
southern front. So use dark green for the base color in southern
front. Its reflectance is approximately 8.4%.

Note : In this document, brightness is explained by reflectance
substitutability, because of the immature color science in those days.

Actual camouflage method
1) The most effective camouflage pattern is the cloud pattern, paints
TUTIKUSA-IRO, TUCHI-IRO, and KAREKUSA-IRO alternately. The ratio of
painting area is
TUTIKUSA-IRO : 50%
TUCHI-IRO : 30%
KAREKUSA-IRO :20%
In addition, do not paint black border line between the patterns.
2) If the deployed area is restricted to the southern area, or if
there was enough time for re-painting in spring and summer, change
TUTIKUSA-IRO to KUSA-IRO.
KUSA-IRO : 50%
TUCHI-IRO : 30%
HunterCottage
#116
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Posted: Friday, February 22, 2002 - 11:11 PM UTC
Oh, I forgot the url to the website Taki has:

http://member.nifty.ne.jp/takixxx/

The actual vehicle spoke of is mentioned under Gun Tanks of the AFV section in the website.
Kencelot
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Posted: Saturday, February 23, 2002 - 01:47 AM UTC
Thank you very much Brian. Really appreciate it. I had a funny feeling after the first couple of sites I visited that the Type 1 75mm was painted in the typical IJA camo pattern.

Hmmm... maybe if he (my brother) does'nt want to do a camo scheme, I could talk him into painting it is US colors to represent a "captured' tank.

I know I would...lol :-)
HunterCottage
#116
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Posted: Saturday, February 23, 2002 - 03:58 AM UTC
Glad to be of help...it feels good to have at least helped you want to have your brother paint the tank in captured american colors

(you're still the boss though...)
Kencelot
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Posted: Monday, March 18, 2002 - 08:43 AM UTC
Gunnie, hopefully you will find this post.

With that new book you just picked up, is there anything listed there on the different IJA tank or armor camo colors??? Is there anything showing only one color used??? In particular the above mentioned...Type 1 75mm SPG???
TIA


Thanks Jim for the "search" feature...would have taken quite some time to find this post without it!
Sabot
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Posted: Monday, March 18, 2002 - 08:48 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Does anyone with reference material have anything which tells or shows a single color which may have been used on their tanks????

Sure, kind of an overall charcoal black accompanied by several irregular holes which allow you to see the matching interior
Kencelot
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Posted: Monday, March 18, 2002 - 08:52 AM UTC
LOL...Rob, wasn't expecting that!

Sounds about right though...although I was sort of looking for the paint colors before they were all blowed up.
GunTruck
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Posted: Monday, March 18, 2002 - 09:09 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Gunnie, hopefully you will find this post. With that new book you just picked up, is there anything listed there on the different IJA tank or armor camo colors??? Is there anything showing only one color used??? In particular the above mentioned...Type 1 75mm SPG???
TIA



Just checked - Volume 1 only covers the heavy tanks, light tanks, and armored cars. They indicate at their website http://aj-press.home.pl that there may be a future release covering artillery. Hope so, this book is well done. They do a series on the Panther too, and Germanophiles really seem to like that series too...

Gunnie