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A guntruck idea i have would it work?
Tim
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Posted: Sunday, March 10, 2002 - 09:26 AM UTC
The Ontos would fit and it would scare heck out of the enemy. Reloading would be tough. Would make a great model. BTW the 7th Transportation Group built a prototype Guntruck in 1991 in Saudi and a new gun truck was used in Haiti. :-)
TreadHead
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Posted: Sunday, March 10, 2002 - 09:33 AM UTC
Howdy Tim, I'd like to be the first to welcome you to the BEST armour site on the web! Appreciate your input on the Guntruck idea. There's been some discussion along those (Ontos) particular lines.
Have you read the entire thread? Very interesting stuff.

Tread.
GunTruck
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Posted: Sunday, March 10, 2002 - 09:58 AM UTC
Are you kidding Tread - Timothy Kutta wrote the Squadron Signal book "Gun Trucks" - if you're indeed Tim Kutta, welcome and I loved your book!

Gunnie
Tim
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Posted: Sunday, March 10, 2002 - 10:44 AM UTC
I did indeed write the book and a couple of others. The Gun Truck crews are a rare breed. I don't think they had plans for an Ontos/Gun Truck but I'm pretty sure if they would have gotten their hands on an Ontos, at least some of the parts and all the106s would have been added for convoy protection. :-)
TreadHead
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Posted: Sunday, March 10, 2002 - 12:15 PM UTC
The REAL Tim Kutta!.....Well shut my mouth, no, wait a minute, can't do that...my FOOT is in it!

Tread.
TreadHead
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Posted: Sunday, March 10, 2002 - 12:24 PM UTC
Again, welcome to the site Tim. As I said in an earlier post, I just love this thread. It can only get more interesting with your input.
BTW, aside from the Ontos, what do you think of the idea of multiple mini guns mounted on one?

Tread.

P.S. I also have your book. Excellent stuff! Must have been a labour of love.
Tim
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Posted: Sunday, March 10, 2002 - 07:14 PM UTC
Thanks for the welcome and the kind words about the book. It is a great subject. One of teh crewmen, who named several of the guntrucks has also written a book. No idea when it will be out. The multiple minigun guntruck is great idea. It will keep everyone's head down but I'd hate to have to load all the ammo :-)
GunTruck
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Posted: Sunday, March 10, 2002 - 10:37 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Thanks for the welcome and the kind words about the book. It is a great subject. One of teh crewmen, who named several of the guntrucks has also written a book. No idea when it will be out. The multiple minigun guntruck is great idea. It will keep everyone's head down but I'd hate to have to load all the ammo :-)



I've been conversing with Jim Lyles about his new book over the past year or so. It's with the publishers now - hopefully it'll be done before the end of the year. I'm honored, as Jim included photos of my gun truck "Nancy" miniature in his new book. I hope they don't get edited out!

Gunnie
210cav
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Posted: Sunday, March 10, 2002 - 11:18 PM UTC
Gunnie--let us know if we can put a collective push on the publisher to ensure your work is displayed.
DJ
GunTruck
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Posted: Sunday, March 10, 2002 - 11:28 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Gunnie--let us know if we can put a collective push on the publisher to ensure your work is displayed.
DJ



:-) Thanks for the support DJ :-) Actually, I'm hopeful because Jim approached me after trading several e-mails about gun trucks. He's the author, so I think he'll get all the material he wants into the reference. It should really be interesting, as Tim alluded too. Jim Lyles was the NCOIC of the gun trucks Maverick and Cold Sweat. The bulk of the photos and information in the reference book are from gun truck veterans themselves - I can't think of a better source or authority. I can make all the logical assumptions and intrepretations of historical accounts I want - but those guys were there and they did it. So, I'm hoping the publisher does them justice...

Gunnie
Armor135
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Posted: Sunday, March 10, 2002 - 11:44 PM UTC
Ok the idea about the Vulcan as a guntruck are we talking about the M113 with the Vulcan on it or a different vechile?

Hey Tim do you have any pics. or any links to that guntruck they had in Saudi?

Mike
GunTruck
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Posted: Monday, March 11, 2002 - 12:00 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Ok the idea about the Vulcan as a guntruck are we talking about the M113 with the Vulcan on it or a different vechile?

Hey Tim do you have any pics. or any links to that guntruck they had in Saudi?

Mike



Yes Mike, the M163 Vulcan (the M113 based vehicle).

Gunnie
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Posted: Monday, March 11, 2002 - 01:22 AM UTC
That might be a tough match. From what I remember, when the M113 chassis was stripped of running gear, engine, tranny and all unnecessary parts, it put a strain on the 5 ton. IIRC from my BMO days with the 1st Cav, the ADA battalion used to always have problems getting M113 running gear parts. They wore them out because the Vulcan turret added about a ton to the standard M113 chassis (M163 had a little beefier suspension than the common M113). Any way, adding a Vulcan to the bed of a 5 ton might be the straw that breaks the camel's back. And as Tim said, that's quite a load of ammo!
GunTruck
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Posted: Monday, March 11, 2002 - 01:26 AM UTC
Yes - that's why we went with a Mack M123 10-ton cargo truck for our fantasy gun truck to carry the Vulcan - "Big Vulcan"...

Gunnie
Armor135
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Posted: Monday, March 11, 2002 - 03:57 AM UTC
Ok just wanted to make sure. Maybee after i do the Ontos fantast guntruck and the 2 by Hobby Fan, and the one from Legend iam thinking about making another one. So i need some adive on scratch building it whenever i get around to it, so this would be my first actual scratchbuilding of any kind. First of all what can i use for the armor plateing for teh side? What can i use to mount either a 50cal. or a Mini gun on each of the sides. and is there a mount i can use for the back? And any ofher information ot hints would really help.

Thanks,
Mike
Tim
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Posted: Monday, March 11, 2002 - 07:56 AM UTC
The one in Saudi was just a prototype. It was a 923 which was set to get armored sides, front and back of the bed. The vehice was like the early guntrucks of Vietnam. I don't think it was ever completed. The campaign ended too quickly. TACOM has a picture of the Haiti guntruck. I might have one here. Will check.
BTW I think the minigun on the guntrucks was off a helicopter. I think it was an XM274, I'm not sure of that. It was a much smaller and easier to handle minigun.
TreadHead
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Posted: Monday, March 11, 2002 - 08:04 AM UTC
Hmmm, my thoughts exactly Tim. The smaller versions would seem the better choice.

Thx, Tread.

P.S. If anyone can do it, Gunnie can!
puyallup7400
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Posted: Monday, March 11, 2002 - 08:37 AM UTC
How about Legends ( http://www.www-legend.co.kr/main.htm ) new minigun (LF1038 1/35 XM-134 Mini Gun set?) The minigun is from their gun truck (LF1034 1/35 Gun Truck) kit.

Sabot the floatation cells for the M-163; are they part of the hull or bolt on? Could they be removed easily? The cells could prevent the hull from sitting in the bed.

Shameless plug for R&J ( http://www.rjproducts.com/ ) follows. Talked with both Rich and Joy at the Seattle show. They do carry Legend products but, Rich has not seen the miniguns yet. He does carry a nice modern ammo can he said, cast it for a guy who was doing a gun truck . Whole new meaning for the term bed liner.

The guns would be mounted on a field fabricated mount. Just remember the feed chutes when setting up the firing arcs.

Dave
TreadHead
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Posted: Sunday, March 17, 2002 - 07:51 AM UTC
:-) Many thx for the legends link Dave, checked them out and they look good! Also, the R&J link is helpful. I just add them to my bookmarks for later access. Sorry to hear they don't stock the miniguns. NP.
Regarding the 'bed liner' issue and the firing arcs of the XM-134's. Just confirmed the floor of the cargo bed thing with Gunnie. Fascinating. Never having seen the inside of one I thought it was interesting to actually use the ammo cans as a 'floor'. When I thought about the idea of mounting multiple mini guns on the guntrucks I originally came up with the idea of storing the ammo (to feed the miniguns) underneath a fake floor so it was out of the way. Good to know I wasn't too far off the mark. Although Gunnie set me straight with the real reason they used the ammo boxes.

Tread.
GunTruck
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Posted: Monday, March 18, 2002 - 04:16 AM UTC

Quoted Text

:-) Many thx for the legends link Dave, checked them out and they look good! Also, the R&J link is helpful. I just add them to my bookmarks for later access. Sorry to hear they don't stock the miniguns. NP.



Tread - give Squadron Mail Order a try, that's where I got mine...

Gunnie