Quoted Text
I usually fill those voids with curse words.
Hilarious!
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how would you fill this?
Kenaicop
#384
Joined: August 23, 2005
KitMaker: 1,426 posts
Armorama: 1,316 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 - 03:17 AM UTC
Hilarious!
GulfWarrior
Campaigns AdministratorJoined: January 05, 2010
KitMaker: 1,051 posts
Armorama: 1,029 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 - 03:53 AM UTC
I usually use Liquid Paper correction fluid for something like that then sand it down with one of those afore mentioned scratch pens (fiberglass bristles).
JPTRR
Managing Editor
#051
Joined: December 21, 2002
KitMaker: 7,772 posts
Armorama: 2,447 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 - 04:03 AM UTC
Joseph,
Thank you for the information about super glue and baking soda. I did not know that.
I'm loving this thread. I've got some older kits I'm dying to get start on, and they've got plenty of ejector circles. So This Thread is going to come in very very very handy! Thanks everybody!
Thank you for the information about super glue and baking soda. I did not know that.
I'm loving this thread. I've got some older kits I'm dying to get start on, and they've got plenty of ejector circles. So This Thread is going to come in very very very handy! Thanks everybody!
RLlockie
Joined: September 06, 2013
KitMaker: 1,112 posts
Armorama: 938 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 - 04:19 AM UTC
It is possible for the part to be hollow but that looks like a Schuerze bracket for a Jpz IV and that particular part is solid, although the steel is much thinner so the plastic part isn’t hugely realistic anyway. Aber and possibly others make the part in etch and they aren’t hard to build.
For that sort of filling, I favour water-based putty which can be smoothed flat when wet, minimising the necessary sanding afterwards.
For that sort of filling, I favour water-based putty which can be smoothed flat when wet, minimising the necessary sanding afterwards.
Kevlar06
Joined: March 15, 2009
KitMaker: 3,670 posts
Armorama: 2,052 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 - 05:13 AM UTC
I see several references to the fiberglass "scratch pens". While I'm always looking for good tips, this is one I'd urge caution for. Always remember fiberglass dust is an irritant, and fine shards of fiberglass should not be inhaled or left on bare skin. When working with it, make sure you're wearing gloves, or even a gauze face mask and googles if you are sensitive to dust. I have a modeling friend who started using one of these "pens" exclusively in place of sanding sticks and was doing quite a lot of sanding. He ended up in the ER with a rash on his arm, and severe eye irritation. In the end, his workbench had to be "decontaminated" because of copious amounts of fiberglass "dust". He no longer uses these "pens" due to his sensitivity. I still use a small one occasionally, but I always wear gloves, and I always "sand" over a disposable towel or other surface.
VR, Russ
VR, Russ
Grauwolf
#084
Joined: September 14, 2005
KitMaker: 2,485 posts
Armorama: 743 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 - 06:19 AM UTC
Quoted Text
I have a modeling friend who started using one of these "pens" exclusively in place of sanding sticks and was doing quite a lot of sanding. He ended up in the ER with a rash on his arm, and severe eye irritation.
Those pens are not intended to be used for general sanding.
As the name implies, they are meant for scratch removal or
leveling off an excessive thick edge on a decal.
General sanding with these pens is basically futile.
And most importantly READ the safety warning on the package.
Cheers,
Kevlar06
Joined: March 15, 2009
KitMaker: 3,670 posts
Armorama: 2,052 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 - 07:41 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextI have a modeling friend who started using one of these "pens" exclusively in place of sanding sticks and was doing quite a lot of sanding. He ended up in the ER with a rash on his arm, and severe eye irritation.
Those pens are not intended to be used for general sanding.
As the name implies, they are meant for scratch removal or
leveling off an excessive thick edge on a decal.
General sanding with these pens is basically futile.
And most importantly READ the safety warning on the package.
Cheers,
Actually, they were originally intended for automotive paint shop use, (which generally requires protective equipment anyway) but have since morphed into many applications and are widely available on Amazon and other sites. They also come in varying sizes--some are quite large. And some don't come with any warnings. But they are all made of friable fiberglass strands, which behave in a similar manner as asbestos-- they shatter into fine particles which can be easily breathed or deposited as dust on the skin. Now, if you use it carefully in a pass or two, There's probably not much chance of having a problem, but repetitious sanding in a small area without much care as to where the dust goes, and you can have a problem (such as my modeling acquaintance did). I should mention he'd been using a pen with a fairly wide tip, and it took several weeks for the problem to show up. The ER Doc treated it as an allergy at first, and it took a referral to a dermatologist to figure out what was going on. But after asking him if he'd been around any fiberglass lately, it occurred to him he'd been using the pen. He had to dispose of his work clothing (washing won't necessarily remove fiberglass fibers), vacuum his entire work area, clean all his tools, and dispose of the pens. He'd been wearing gloves, but the fiberglass fibers had migrated past them to his wrist and up his right arm beneath his shirt. He'd also rubbed some into his eyes, which thankfully recovered. Bottom line-- it pays to take precautions with all the materials modelers use. Some can sneak up on you. There are a couple of good tutorials on hazards modelers face-- Paul Budzik has one, there's one called "The Toxicoligy of Modeling" over on LSP, and I think Kitmaker has had at least one feature.
VR, Russ Bucy
panzerbob01
Joined: March 06, 2010
KitMaker: 3,128 posts
Armorama: 2,959 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 - 08:21 AM UTC
What Russ said is absolutely "square on". Many of us treat many of our tools and materials in a rather cavalier fashion...
I have tried out these fibre-glass sanding pens. They do work, but I quickly noticed that tiny glass filaments were getting scattered across my bench - which means they were in my clothing, on my skin, on the floor, etc.
For me, this raised the thought that, if I think it a good idea to wear a Tyvek "moon suit", mask, googles, gloves, and booties when I climbed into my attic to work on electric cables buried in fibre-glass insulation... probably the same approach would be prudent when working with that glass pen... It's the same stuff, with the same risks and the same propensity to get everywhere.
I would strongly suggest that folks keep in mind that if you think you need to wear gloves, goggle, any protective clothing, and / or a mask of any sort when working with anything... bear in mind that you may well have effectively protected parts of yourself from immediate exposure, but the reality is that your working space is now contaminated. This goes for your garage work-shop just as much as it goes for your hobby bench and room, and vice-versa.
Most folks vent their spray-booths and are aware that paint aerosols and solvents are hazards. Treat your other hobby activities with equal awareness and precautions.
Because I don't like my hobby room to become a hazardous space... I do all my resin work and fibre-glass handling, and even some of my styrene sanding, outside at a table in the open air.
Cheers! Bob
I have tried out these fibre-glass sanding pens. They do work, but I quickly noticed that tiny glass filaments were getting scattered across my bench - which means they were in my clothing, on my skin, on the floor, etc.
For me, this raised the thought that, if I think it a good idea to wear a Tyvek "moon suit", mask, googles, gloves, and booties when I climbed into my attic to work on electric cables buried in fibre-glass insulation... probably the same approach would be prudent when working with that glass pen... It's the same stuff, with the same risks and the same propensity to get everywhere.
I would strongly suggest that folks keep in mind that if you think you need to wear gloves, goggle, any protective clothing, and / or a mask of any sort when working with anything... bear in mind that you may well have effectively protected parts of yourself from immediate exposure, but the reality is that your working space is now contaminated. This goes for your garage work-shop just as much as it goes for your hobby bench and room, and vice-versa.
Most folks vent their spray-booths and are aware that paint aerosols and solvents are hazards. Treat your other hobby activities with equal awareness and precautions.
Because I don't like my hobby room to become a hazardous space... I do all my resin work and fibre-glass handling, and even some of my styrene sanding, outside at a table in the open air.
Cheers! Bob
flyers42
Joined: November 23, 2014
KitMaker: 62 posts
Armorama: 60 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 - 09:45 AM UTC
you mean a paper punch? this circle is much smaller than standard hole punch
btw thanks for all of the responses
btw thanks for all of the responses
flyers42
Joined: November 23, 2014
KitMaker: 62 posts
Armorama: 60 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 - 09:46 AM UTC
Quoted Text
I use a punch set to make disks out of .005 or even .010 Evergreen sheet and glue them in place. Not surprisingly punch sizes correspond to the standard ejector pin sizes, so it's usually an excellent fit. These can be sanded down flush without changing the surface contour, unlike filling with putty or sanding them out.
KL
what do you mean by a punch set?
165thspc
#521
Joined: April 13, 2011
KitMaker: 9,465 posts
Armorama: 8,695 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 - 09:56 AM UTC
My local Leather Shop also sells leather working tools. That is where I got my punch set. It consists of two mandibles and an assortment of screw in circle cutting dies of various diameters 1/16" thru 9/32". They also sell a tool that looks like a big set of pliers with a rotating wheel with various punch sizes you can select. I find I am able to position the smaller individual hand held punches more precisely and you get a greater selection of die sizes with these sets as opposed to the pliers.
Place the raw plastic stock on a forgiving surface like one of the popular work bench green cutting pads, ** position the tool and give it a light tap with a small hammer. You will now have beaucoupe disks galore!
This set was under $40 USD so I am going with these!
** The same company that makes the big cutting pads also sells a small 4" x 4" pad as shown above. I use the small one for such jobs as these and when it gets too dinged up I replace it - inexpensive enough.
Place the raw plastic stock on a forgiving surface like one of the popular work bench green cutting pads, ** position the tool and give it a light tap with a small hammer. You will now have beaucoupe disks galore!
This set was under $40 USD so I am going with these!
** The same company that makes the big cutting pads also sells a small 4" x 4" pad as shown above. I use the small one for such jobs as these and when it gets too dinged up I replace it - inexpensive enough.
Frenchy
Joined: December 02, 2002
KitMaker: 12,719 posts
Armorama: 12,507 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 - 09:59 AM UTC
Quoted Text
what do you mean by a punch set?
https://www.hiroboy.com/BIG_Punch_and_Die_Set_12_different_punch_tool_from_2mm_to_45mm--product--7936.html
H.P.
Headhunter506
Joined: December 01, 2007
KitMaker: 1,575 posts
Armorama: 1,509 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 - 10:02 AM UTC
165thspc
#521
Joined: April 13, 2011
KitMaker: 9,465 posts
Armorama: 8,695 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 - 11:04 AM UTC
This will probably be considered sacrilege but . . . .
If it were me I would carefully and slowly drill the largest hole I could right in the center of that ejector pin mark. This would make the brackets look lighter, more open, more delicate and more detailed.
They would be wrong but they would look good.
If it were me I would carefully and slowly drill the largest hole I could right in the center of that ejector pin mark. This would make the brackets look lighter, more open, more delicate and more detailed.
They would be wrong but they would look good.
Headhunter506
Joined: December 01, 2007
KitMaker: 1,575 posts
Armorama: 1,509 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 - 11:28 AM UTC
Quoted Text
They would be wrong
Which is why it shouldn't be done. Would you use Minilite rims on a Humvee?
flyers42
Joined: November 23, 2014
KitMaker: 62 posts
Armorama: 60 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 - 12:03 PM UTC
does the punch set have many uses in modeling?
KurtLaughlin
Joined: January 18, 2003
KitMaker: 2,402 posts
Armorama: 2,377 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 - 12:27 PM UTC
Quoted Text
does the punch set have many uses in modeling?
It comes down to how much detailing you do. If it's a lot (not scratchbuilding mind you, but detailing existing kits) you'll use it plenty and enjoy the results you'll get. If you want to scratchbuild it is a necessity.
If you are a guy who does not spend a lot of time on any individual model or someone who likes painting and weathering more than construction, it's probably not going to be worth it to you. If you think you want to focus more on making your models look realistic, maybe you should start thinking about where you could use it.
I would not get one just to fill in ejector pin marks.
KL
165thspc
#521
Joined: April 13, 2011
KitMaker: 9,465 posts
Armorama: 8,695 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 - 12:32 PM UTC
Well said Kurt!
Personally, I feel like my scratch building really took off after purchasing the set but as you say I am into construction and detailing and those are my primary interests.
Personally, I feel like my scratch building really took off after purchasing the set but as you say I am into construction and detailing and those are my primary interests.
Kevlar06
Joined: March 15, 2009
KitMaker: 3,670 posts
Armorama: 2,052 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 - 02:18 PM UTC
Quoted Text
My local Leather Shop also sells leather working tools. That is where I got my punch set. It consists of two mandibles and an assortment of screw in circle cutting dies of various diameters 1/16" thru 9/32". They also sell a tool that looks like a big set of pliers with a rotating wheel with various punch sizes you can select. I find I am able to position the smaller individual hand held punches more precisely and you get a greater selection of die sizes with these sets as opposed to the pliers.
Place the raw plastic stock on a forgiving surface like one of the popular work bench green cutting pads, ** position the tool and give it a light tap with a small hammer. You will now have beaucoupe disks galore!
This set was under $40 USD so I am going with these!
** The same company that makes the big cutting pads also sells a small 4" x 4" pad as shown above. I use the small one for such jobs as these and when it gets too dinged up I replace it - inexpensive enough.
You can buy this punch set and a slightly larger one at Michael's for about $20. I have this and the larger set I use for punching out disks of tape for masking purposes. But I also have a little more expensive set of steel punches I bought at Micro-Mark years ago (about $40 then, I think it's up to $60 now). That set has lasted me for years, and I particularly like it as it comes with a clear plexiglass top, so you can see what you're punching. I agree, if you're just slapping kit parts together, don't bother buying an expensive set. But.... you'd be amazed what you can do with a good quality punch and die set. I've made vac-form masters, spacers, washers, large scale rivets, and all kinds of detailing (as well as scratchbuilding) parts. Whenever I "punch" something, I make it a point to do 10-12 punches in a session, even if I only need one or two. I throw the extras into a can, so if I need a "disc" I always have one handy. I particularly like using my punch set to make circular masks, by sticking masking tape onto a plastic sheet, punching out a disk and peeling the tape off. Another great application is to punch out circles of colored decal paper-- I've used them to represent everything from rivet lines and marker lights to fasteners. You can easily make instrument panels with a punch set. You can get a good reflector by painting clear decal paper silver, then overcoating it with Tamiya's clear red or amber paint. The possibilities are only limited by your imagination.
VR, Russ
165thspc
#521
Joined: April 13, 2011
KitMaker: 9,465 posts
Armorama: 8,695 posts
Posted: Friday, October 11, 2019 - 12:48 AM UTC
Just on a hunch I did some very brief research . . . .
I could not find a close up photo of a real Schurzen Mounting Bracket on a German tank but I did come across Eduard's take on those same brackets, in this case for a Panther.
You will notice that both Aber and Eduard seem to think those brackets would have a hole drilled through their center.
Sorry - it was just a gut hunch that I had to persue.
I could not find a close up photo of a real Schurzen Mounting Bracket on a German tank but I did come across Eduard's take on those same brackets, in this case for a Panther.
You will notice that both Aber and Eduard seem to think those brackets would have a hole drilled through their center.
Sorry - it was just a gut hunch that I had to persue.
Removed by original poster on 10/11/19 - 13:06:27 (GMT).
Removed by original poster on 10/11/19 - 13:43:45 (GMT).
Grauwolf
#084
Joined: September 14, 2005
KitMaker: 2,485 posts
Armorama: 743 posts
Posted: Friday, October 11, 2019 - 02:34 AM UTC
To add to Michael's comment, if you are indeed building a Panther G, then the brackets
should have a hole, not quite as large as the pin mark but the hole is there.
Eduard and Aber are correct in their representation.
See photo of real bracket here:(Click to enlarge)
https://www.flickr.com/photos/mugsandb/29492589887
These 3D printed aftermarket brackets also show the hole.
https://www.shapeways.com/product/YPGES3GNU/panther-g-schurzen-brackets
Cheers,
should have a hole, not quite as large as the pin mark but the hole is there.
Eduard and Aber are correct in their representation.
See photo of real bracket here:(Click to enlarge)
https://www.flickr.com/photos/mugsandb/29492589887
These 3D printed aftermarket brackets also show the hole.
https://www.shapeways.com/product/YPGES3GNU/panther-g-schurzen-brackets
Cheers,
165thspc
#521
Joined: April 13, 2011
KitMaker: 9,465 posts
Armorama: 8,695 posts
Posted: Friday, October 11, 2019 - 03:18 PM UTC
Amazing find Joe, on the bracket photo!
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